Click here to go to the NEW College Discussion Forum

Hello Everybody!!
I'm going to be a sophomore next year and really want to go to an ivy or other elite school. But i was just wondering is it worth it?
I mean studying like mad for AP's, stressing over ACT's, and nearly having your brains ooze out of your ears so that you may have a mere -chance- at an ivy? And have to pay back your enormous loans on top of that after graduation?
What i'm trying to say is why go to an ivy and probably not enjoy it; while you could just go to a good state school or liberal arts school or whatever; and get the same job? Do the ivies get you higher pay in the real world or is it just prestige?
Thanx for any input and your opinions!!!

By Gianscolere (Gianscolere) on Tuesday, June 03, 2003 - 06:09 pm: Edit

Studies say an Ivy League degree doesn't necessarily gaurantee a higher job salary, at least here in the US. However, it may be to your advantage if you plan to work in another country where there are not a lot of good workers.

I think prestige has a lot to do with it, because people want to have something to brag about. And here in America, going to Harvard or a prestige-equivalent university will certainly raise eyebrows. While an Ivy League education may not necessarily be better, the student bodies at the Ivies are undoubtedly one of the best in the world (because these schools are so selective), so the college experience can be enhanced even further if you get the chance to work with them.

I, too, want to go to an Ivy League or Stanford/University of Chicago/Northwestern. Best of luck to both of us then! I'm a freshman, so I have 3 more years before college.

By Andymcgav (Andymcgav) on Wednesday, June 04, 2003 - 12:07 pm: Edit

We just want to say that we went to Harvard, duh!

By Arthurd (Arthurd) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 06:23 pm: Edit

I guess I'll add my 2 cents in here and agree with the other two postings: Many of the Ivies are highly over-rated (not mentioning any names of course) while there are MANY non-ivies that are excellent schools (IE. Stanford, MIT, Berkeley and several others). Yes, there are even non-ivy schools that are great schools who go unnoticed by the general public, but are well known by the industry (which counts when you are getting your pay checks a few years from now). As an engineering major, I can testify that schools like RPI, RIT, and Cooper Union fit this description. Don't get too caught up in the name of a college, because that's all it is, a name. Sure, it sounds 'nice' to say "Hi, I'm a Harvard grad," but in the long run that matters little or nothing. Having said that, don't mistake what I'm saying as a cue to take it easy. Any school worth going to will want a dedicated and hard working student who will positively contribute to their University. Make the best of your high school career (mine is just ending and I miss it already) and good luck in the future.

By Nygaard21 (Nygaard21) on Thursday, June 05, 2003 - 08:35 pm: Edit

Thank you everybody,
I do agree with all of you on most points and any more input from anybody else would be liked also!

By Ariesathena (Ariesathena) on Monday, June 16, 2003 - 01:47 am: Edit

A few thoughts from a recent college grad:
*The Ivies are a club. You meet people who know (or who have parents who know) famous people, top professionals, etc. You definitely get more out of your fellow students than the school.
*It is more important to have a caring faculty, small classes, working alongside profs, and a choice of majors (or how you dual major), than a big name school. Many of the "top" schools are too large to provide most of that.
*Look into who actually teaches the classes and what degrees they have attained. Some lesser-known schools have Ph.D. (or terminal degree) professors teaching 99% of the classes, while others have TAs teaching them.
*You have a better chance initially of getting a job with an Ivy education because of the networking. After that, it doesn't matter. Also, the pay rate is not likely to be much different (if at all) from top LAC graduates, as pay is based on experience in the field (which internships may count for) and the industry average. Many companies are too large to provide highly individualized salaries for its entry-level workers. Unless you are in the sciences and attended MIT, for example, where you went for undergrad really won't matter.
*Grad school actually matters more for prestige.
*Division I schools are often the most prestigous (the peer assessment on the USNews rankings correlates most directly to athletic prowess), and thus, there can be more of a focus on athletes at the expense of academics. Not good, not worth it.

Good luck! Don't stress over the "top" school; you begin to realize that you can be happier and receive a better education at a smaller (and therefore often lesser-known) school.

By Shelly (Shelly) on Monday, June 16, 2003 - 10:25 pm: Edit

One thing to keep in mind about the ivies and other "elite" universities is that undergraduates are more a source of income for the university than anything else. Their reputation is based on the quality of their faculty and graduate programs, so that is what really matters to them, and since they know that there will never be a shortage of undergraduates and their checkbook-waving parents beating down the door to get in, they have little reason to be overly concerned about the quality of their undergraduate programs.
While these schools certainly have a lot to offer, and I’m not trying to discourage anyone from attending one, there are equally good schools out there that will probably care more about you and your experience, since they can’t ride on their prestige alone, and actually have to work to attract and keep good students. I recently read a thread on this site at http://www.collegeconfidential.com/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?4/13634 that I thought was pretty cool.
Good luck with your decision.

By Jawharpist (Jawharpist) on Tuesday, June 17, 2003 - 08:44 am: Edit

Old fart note: I'm sure you have seen this message on many of the threads - You must find a school that matches "you".

The only other note I would like to make is this - Are you ready now to decide that you do not want to go to a highly selective school? If you "think" you "might want to" you must focus your HS academic to accomplish this. You won’t be able to "go back" and take the classes you needed to.

Good luck - have fun - stay focused on "your" goals.

By Thedad (Thedad) on Tuesday, June 17, 2003 - 12:22 pm: Edit

College is what you make of it and some of it depends on both your learning style(s) and what you're studying.

I've been doing total immersion on this college search and applications process for about eight months now after having done a moderate about of research for the preceding two years. I've changed my mind from initial opinions about some things, one of them being the advantage of a good LAC: the individual attention and the small classes/labs are a tremendous asset for many students. In this, they will almost always cream the various state schools.

But to answer Nygaard's question, that still doesn't mean slacking off in high school. There are considerable advantages to a more competitive LAC over a less competitive LAC...I think one of the most undervalued aspects of the college experience is who your peers are. The brighter, more challenging, more stimulating your peers are, the more *you* can get from your college experience. This, to me, is one of the appeals of the Ivies, not the "brand" name, but there are many non-Ivy schools that will offer the same benefit.

My general paradigm would be to look for the schools that are the most competitive *that you are comfortable in.*

Implicit in this is some degree of self-recognition about size of fish vs. size of pond. My D, for instance, doesn't want to be anywhere near one of the brightest on campus...doesn't want to be tail-end Charlie, either, but slotting in at roughly the bottom one-quarter mark would be fine with her. She's got enough ego strength to know how bright she is and not be intimidated by those who are brighter still; conversely, she doesn't want to be in classes full of people she finds dull. Ymmv.

By Nygaard21 (Nygaard21) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:10 pm: Edit

those are very good points Thedad and Jawharpist!
i have no means of slacking off in high school but maybe don't want to go to an ivy although stanford is looking very good! except the admissions are very competitive...

thanx for the input!!

By Thedad (Thedad) on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 06:44 pm: Edit

You're welcome.

By Agentx004 (Agentx004) on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 06:52 am: Edit

Q: Are Ivies worth it?

A: Yes

By Finalnight (Finalnight) on Friday, July 11, 2003 - 08:38 am: Edit

Q: Are Ivies worth it?
A: Only if you are too lame to make your own connections