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hi all
i can't decide btwn northwestern and berkeley! i'm either going to berkeley to do engineering (or econs) or northwestern to do a double major in engineering (or econs) and communications...

any advice?? the deadline for deciding is fast approaching!

P.S berkeley seems more prestigious but nw's environment seems better

By Rayray222 (Rayray222) on Tuesday, April 27, 2004 - 06:26 am: Edit

Go Berkeley. Berkeley's environment is better in my opinion.

Everyone that goes to NW regrets it.

By Theguy121 (Theguy121) on Tuesday, April 27, 2004 - 10:57 pm: Edit

NU is more prestigious in the midwest, and Berkeley in the west coast, but the environment, I think, is clearly better at NU. It gets cold during winter, though... but during warm days, it's awesome to hang out on the beach, and it overlooks the Chicago sky-line, so at night, you can view the entire city in lights (not to mention that you can visit the city whenever you want, since it's only 15 minutes away). Plus, NU's campus is beautiful.

By Boxosox (Boxosox) on Tuesday, April 27, 2004 - 11:00 pm: Edit

So NU's got your kind of environment AND prestige, NU seems to be winning here...

By Sardonia (Sardonia) on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 - 07:17 pm: Edit

Depends on where you plan on working.

Keep in mind that globally, berkeley is well known.

In comparison, although Northwestern has a brighter student body (factoring in the average student), it is not as well known.

If your parents are paying for the education:

visit each campus and walk around for awhile. Sit in the cafeterias; visit the libraries.

You'll no where you belong soon after. Trust your intuitive judgement.

By Rayray222 (Rayray222) on Wednesday, April 28, 2004 - 07:29 pm: Edit

Although on the average Northwestern students have a higher SAT score than Berkeley, it is because berkeley admits in athletes and people with a underpriveledged story at a high rate.

If you take the top 10- 20% of students at Berkeley, they will beat NU's top 10-20 hands down.

But other than that I would have to agree with sardonis. Berkeley prestige worldwide beats NU hands down. A very large gap.

By Honeydew731 (Honeydew731) on Thursday, April 29, 2004 - 10:11 pm: Edit

when i went there the two responses that i recieved when i asked student why they had choosen NU were
1. "well i didn't get into Yale/Harvard/John Hopkins"
2. I applied for the school of journalism.
I didn't get the same feeling of enthusiasm for the school ( other than journalism or theater/communications students) as i did at berkeley. People at Cal which choose to go there over an IVy because of the cost/location or something like that. People at Northwestern can afford an expensive tuition or are willing to pay it- they would not have choosen it over an ivy.

CHICAGO is not only 15 min. away. it is 40 public transportation, or 30 in a taxi.

at northwestern advising and professor relationships will be forced upon you so they are much easier to get, but at berkeley you can find it if you seek it out. there is ample opportunity.
regarding student body/ socail life. The student body is very homogeneuos- rich, preppy, ivy rejects. it has a very ivy high school feel to it because it is small.when there is class there is nobody walking around outside. IN contrast Berkeley is always bustling. also, greek life at NU consumes the social atmosphere.

heres an experience that blew me away and showed me that i can get anything that i want at CAL:
when i asked if there was a telgu (obscure indian langauge) class offered, a student replied that she was not sure but if i could get a professor to teach it i could make a class of as few as 3 students! thats amazing.

CAL also is world renowned. if you mention northwestern to anybody outside of the US you will get blank stares.
so! it all depends on what you want.

By Sakky (Sakky) on Saturday, May 01, 2004 - 05:55 pm: Edit

Rayray222, once again with the athletes bit? Why do you keep bringing that up? It's a false gambit.

Northwestern also competes in Div1A football and basketball, just like Cal. So both schools admit dumb athletes. The difference is that Northwestern's student population is much smaller than Cal's, and so the presence of dumb athletes pulls down SAT scores at NW much more than they would at Cal. So if anything, when it comes to athletes, Cal actually benefits relative to NW.

As far as your contention that the top 10-20% at Cal is better than the top 10-20% at NW, what is your basis for saying that? You are basically saying that the standard deviation of Berkeley's SAT distribution is significantly larger than that of NW's such that Berkeley's distribution is rather flat. Why do you say that?

The one part that I will agree with you is that with the important exception of Northwestern's Kellog School of Management, which is one of the best, if not the best, B-school in the world, Berkeley's prestige is greater. The question is, just how important is prestige to you?

I furthermore, have to completely disagree with your post that everybody who goes to NW regrets it. Did you seriously say that? So remind me again, what are the alumni donation rates of NW compared to Cal? Oh, I see.

To honeydew, while I agree with a lot of what you posted, I have to caution you that at Cal, you will find a lot of students who'd rather be somewhere else but couldn't get in. Especially to a certain school about 40 miles to the south that shall remain unnamed. For a great many Cal students, Cal was not exactly their first choice.

By Rayray222 (Rayray222) on Saturday, May 01, 2004 - 09:05 pm: Edit

Umm dude.

how important is prestige to me? You were the one talking about prestige.

Your positions often fluctuate. It seems like your only intention is to disparage Cal, even if you contradict what u said earlier.

Like I said, let your anger with Cal go. I dunno why, but u sound like you really really don't like the place for some reason. it will be good for u in your personal growth as well. Things get better, theres a brighter tomorrow man.

By Sakky (Sakky) on Monday, May 03, 2004 - 02:34 am: Edit

Uh, I was the one who talked about prestige first? Really?

Check out the quote you wrote on Wed., April 28, 2004 at 7:28:

"Berkeley prestige worldwide beats NU hands down. A very large gap. "

Is this not your quote? So who started talking about prestige first, you or me? Jeez, rayray222, you can't keep giving me these easy points over and over.

And finally, I don't see why you simply can't see my point. My standing is always clear - Cal is a mixed bag. Some things about Cal are good, and others are bad.

What I don't understand and don't support is people taking a heavily biased position. People are allowed to have their own opinions, but they're not allowed to have their own facts. It's one thing to like Cal for this-and-that reason as long as those reasons have some basis in reality and the opinions you draw from those reasons are logically consistent. It's quite another thing to manufacture reasons for why you like Cal or otherwise draw conclusions that are not supported by those reasons. To say that Cal is somehow hurt by its athletes more so than Northwestern is simply unsupported by the evidence. To say that everybody who goes to NW regrets it is nothing more than a vicious slur. And I'd really like to know what your basis is for saying that the top X% of Cal students is better than the top X% of NW students. What evidence do you have of this.

By Stanfordnualum (Stanfordnualum) on Friday, May 07, 2004 - 12:04 am: Edit

Wow..Sakky, I am impressed. I especially like how you supported your argument with concept of statistical distribution As far as top X% go, the high end of the middle 50% SATs (75 percentile) at NU is still higher than UCB's. But probably what Rayray had in mind was the "sheer number".

By Theguy121 (Theguy121) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 01:37 pm: Edit

You know, the only reason Berkeley is more prestigious internationally than Northwestern is because, about fifty years ago, it was considered on par with Harvard and Yale. They had a very impressive research lab (the name eludes me), where I believe they discovered a whole sleuth of new elements in a very short period of time (including Berkelium…) I believe they sold it, though, or by some means, no longer have access to it. Since then, it’s ‘fallen off’ a little from that throne and is considered, in America, second tier to HYPSM, though still an excellent school. However… for news like that to trickle across seas, to other continents? It would take years and years before another view of Berkeley was reestablished. Besides, California schools generally have good reputations overseas… did you see that one Asian survey where a whole bunch of UCs were considered better than Hopkins, Northwestern, Duke, and Dartmouth? If you plan on living in America, then as I said, Berkeley for the West Coast, and Northwestern for the Midwest.

Rankings:

http://ed.sjtu.edu.cn/rank/rank-2003.mht


Of course, their entire methodology was solely based on scientific research, scientific articles, and Nobel Prizes… clearly there is a preference for scientific and mathematical schools for most internationals, and Berkeley has a great engineering program, so it gets double ‘kudos’ internationally.

By Shadow67 (Shadow67) on Saturday, May 08, 2004 - 05:30 pm: Edit

which school is better for getting a job? NW or UCB?

By Jab93 (Jab93) on Sunday, May 09, 2004 - 12:27 am: Edit

D*mn,
These threads get so frustrating...
Will you people give it a rest wit the
whole idiotic "prestige" comparisons?

Look... both Berkeley and Northwestern are phenomenal institutions... you can get an education beyond your wildest dreams at either place... trust me... you won't come even close to exhausting the myriad opportunities at either.

So, how do you decide?
Visit, get a feel for both campuses, talk with students, walk around campus, check out the surrounding cities, etc... Ask yourself, which do you personally vibe with best? Different people will give different answers... that's OK... what's with the idiotic obsession of trying to convince everyone else that choice X is not only best for you, bust should be best for everyone else as well? What's a good fit for you will NOT necessarily be a good fit for the next guy...

By Mosquito86 (Mosquito86) on Wednesday, May 12, 2004 - 04:43 am: Edit

For one thing you are comparing a public vs. a private. To me...based on sheer type of schools...there are some vast difference. If you want more personal attention and more direct placement..NW is your bet. However, if you don't care about that..UCB may be your school.

I think you will get an equal education at both schools. If you are a California resident..it might be more worth your money to go to Cal. A week ago I was going to choose Cal over NW. However, I just got into HPME, so I'm going to NW (there is more a pull to go to NW now b/c of HPME).

By Stanfordnualum (Stanfordnualum) on Monday, May 17, 2004 - 02:43 am: Edit

Honeydew, I went to NU. I can see you actually know very little about NU. All the stuffs you wrote are pretty much unfounded yet well-known myths perpectuated by guys like you. It's okay to be biased as long as you keep it to yourself rather than showing it to someone who are seriously seeking objective advice. For example, just because 40% of people may be involved in greeks doesn't mean it "consumes the scene". In general, people don't feel they are pressured to join. Many people otuside of the greek system find plenty other stuffs to do on/off campus. It's not a party school; you are not even pressured to drink if you don't want to in greek parties. NU students are smart and well-educated enough to respect each other's choice and social life. It's true that many people at NU were rejected by HYP but many did pick NU as their 1st choice also. In fact, at 40%, NU's yield is higher than many other top-25 schools. Most of my schoolmates are proud of their school regardless if it was their 1st, 2nd, or 10th choice.