INTERNATIONAL ASKS FOR ADVICES





Click here to go to the NEW College Discussion Forum

Discus: What Are My Chances?: August 2004 Archive: INTERNATIONAL ASKS FOR ADVICES
By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Saturday, July 24, 2004 - 06:45 am: Edit

Hi!

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Saturday, July 24, 2004 - 07:05 am: Edit

Hi,

First to say, Iím from Bulgaria Ė Eastern Europe. That automatically means that English isnít my mother tongue and I could hardly beat Americans in Verbal or WritingÖ Anyway, I hope this beginning wasnít very boring:)

My results are:

SAT I Ė Math 760
Verbal 610
(1370)
SAT II Ė Math IIC 790
Physics 760
Writing during the next SAT session
TOEFL 270 (computer based)
Iíll take the SAT I once againÖ

Iíve studied in the best high-school (1st English Language School) in my city which is the 3rd greatest city in Bulgaria. My equivalent of GPA is 5.83 (the maximum is 6.00) which should be something like 3.83. We donít have official ranking of the graduating class but Iím somewhere in the top 10%.

Extra Curriculums:
Iíve been playing piano and keyboards for more than 10 years. Iíve played with some of the famous pop bands in Bulgaria (chiefly with one for a very long period) and we have professional records, concerts, awards and so on. I do not only the playing but also the management and a large part of the technical stuff.

The other thing that Iíve been dedicated to is Math and computer sciences. During high-school I was in the math team. I participated in a lot of math contests. In the 9th grade Iíve reached the final round of the National Math Olympiad Contest. In the 10th grade our school team won the National Math Contest for high-schools and I won the 5th place in the single ranking.

Other Activities :

organizing and participating in every concert and fest in my high-school.(something like unofficial cultural counsellor)
charity concerts.
Iíve participated in the high-school government.
I was in the high-school track and field team.
Essay published in a national newspaper.
And others like thatÖ

I graduated from the high-school two years ago and I moved to the capital of Bulgaria Ė Sofia.
I really hope that this period of two years wonít ruin my chances of admission!!
In Sofia I worked for the family business (heating and air-conditioner engineering) and with my band we tried to break through. During these two years I developed my knowledge in Math and Computer Programming.

Please, tell me honestly, what my chances for a good university in the USA are. I really, really want to go and study in Stanford. Do you think it is possible? Or in the UCLA, UC Berkeley or USC, or maybe in some of the NY leading universities? Actually, could you suggest a list of universities as reaches, matchesÖ (I see that this is popular ranking:)

My greatest problem is that I graduated two years ago and Iím 20 years old now, and that Iíll need some financial aidÖ Is that a really great problem??

Thank you in advance!

P.S.

If anybody wants to study in Bulgaria Ė ask me anytime you wish :):):)

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Saturday, July 24, 2004 - 09:29 am: Edit

I would forget about State Universities altogether. Schools like Cal-Berkeley, Michigan-Ann Arbor, UVA etc... do not give out much financial aid to non-state residents since at least 65% of their student body already gets to attend at highly discounted rates. I would not worry about having graduated from High School 2 years ago. You can easily explain that you were working and saving money in order to finance your education. In fact, schools will probably look favorably on the fact that you are so driven and have acquired some real-world exerience. I am not sure what you want to major in, but here are some recommendations:

1) MIT (reach, but your SAT verbal will be forgiven given that English is not your native tongue)

2) Princeton (reach)

3) Standord (reach)

4) Harvard (reach)

5) Cornell (match)

6) Chicago (match)

7) Columbia (reach)

8) Duke University (Reach)

9) Rice University (reach). Rice is significantly cheaper than most private university and they offer good financial packages.

10) Cooper Union (reach) Cooper Union is free to attend. You only pay for housing and the books. It is an excellent deal and they are good in Engineering and Math.

11) Texas-Austin (match). This is a state university, but the tuition is low enough for you to consider them without any financial aid.

As far as sefeties go, I would lok at a number of private universities that are not quite as selective but good in the field you are interested in. That way, you are guaranteed admission and they may give you some aid to attract you to their offer.

By Cooldude (Cooldude) on Saturday, July 24, 2004 - 10:15 am: Edit

alexandre is right on target!! State universities do no give fin aid to internationals.

here's my assesment:
good stuff: Math competitions, Music and most of all work experience and yu're from Bulgaria (added diversity)

stuff that might work against you: 2 years IMO is a bit long, but you can easily address that issue in your essays.

The list above is damn good.

ADVICE: I can see you are looking forward to Stanford. IMO go for Stanford EA, thats the time they give out all the funds alloted for intl students, + higher acceptance rate.

now some about me, i'm international, i need fin aid, Math & programming competitions, Music (Drumming and percussion), applying EA Stanford, SAT I (600V 800M), SAT II 800IIC 800Phy.

hopefully we'll play some good music together at Stanford!!

By Mirela (Mirela) on Saturday, July 24, 2004 - 01:43 pm: Edit

trialboy az sushto sum ot bulgaria! S udovolstvie shte ti pomogna, ako iskash mi pishi na
mirela@elits.rousse.bg
kazvam se Mirela

By Robyrm (Robyrm) on Saturday, July 24, 2004 - 02:06 pm: Edit

MIT only accepted 4% of the international applicants last year. Unless you are the absolutely best Bulgarian applicant, chances aren't great. I have no idea if the same daunting statistic is true at Stanford, but the issues with International students, especially those needing financial aid, are best addressed specifically by contacting the schools you are interested in- this is a much bigger issue for you than your "time out" as I see it. You might want to broaden your search to other excellent schools with strong engineering/science which might not be as flooded with international applicants as the schools that are listed previously...

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Saturday, July 24, 2004 - 06:41 pm: Edit

I'm interested to major in computer science\management.
Also, what exactly means a "reach" - "forget it", "god knows" or "probably"...:)
And what does "IMO" means.
Sorry for the strange questions :)

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 02:30 am: Edit

Robyrm, MIT is a bit of an exception when it comes to international students. You see, Engineering is the most prestigious and in demand field for international students, and guess what two countries go ape with Engineering? Yup, you guessed, the 2 countries that belong to the we-got-over-one-billion-people-club! You can bet that MIT accepts less than 1% of the applicants from India and China and that is what brings the overall acceptance rate down. My high school in the United Arab Emirates graduates 30 students each year, and on average, 2 of those 30 end up at MIT. Unless a studen is applying from India or China, I would say the acceptance rate of International students is closer to 15%, which is still bloody low!!!

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 02:54 am: Edit

Reach means your chances of getting accepted are low because your scores/grades are too low and/or (in your case), the school is very selective and is a reach for any student.

Match means your chances of getting accepted are decent.

Safety means your chances of getting accepted are good because you are clearly better than the normal applicant to that university.

IMO stands for In My Opinion". Sometimes, people write IMHO, which stands for Ïn My Humble Opinion"!

Now that you told me your intended major, I can give you a better list of schools for you. Keep in mind that you will still have a better chance of getting aid from a Private University.

#1 MIT (reach)
#2 Stanford University (reach)
#3 Cornell University (match)
#4 University of Pennsylvania-Wharton (reach)
#5 Carnegie Mellon University (match)
#6 Princeton University (reach)
#7 Brown University (reach)
#8 University of Texas-Austin (match)
#9 Rice University (reach)
#10 Oberlin College (match)
#11 University of Washington-Seattle (safety)
#12 University of Arizona-Tucson (safety)

If you have any questions, ask away.

By Cooldude (Cooldude) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 04:13 am: Edit

hey alexandre which school did you go to in the UAE, I'm from Dubai and i'm indian so probably no MIT

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 04:20 am: Edit

I work in Dubai right now. I went to Choueifat. You probably attend Choueifat as well. And don't worry about your chances at MIT. Indians in the UAE are not on the same "boat" as Indians from India.

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 07:26 am: Edit

haha..AMAZING...i'm from Dubai as well..I go to ASD (american school of Dubai...) if u happen to not know where that is.

I'll be applying ED to Wharton this year for the class of 2009, my stats are up for critics in the College Admissions area...but I was wondering if, considering that Indians here are not in the same boat as Indians in India, would that mean that i'm not in the same boat as French applicants since i'm French living here in Dubai?

would that somehow make life easier or harder?

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 07:37 am: Edit

Marc, I am a citizen of France myself. No, being French yourself will not hurt your chances. Just make sure you have the right mix of grades, scores and ECs and be sure to communicate your thoughts well on your essays. I got into Penn myself, 12 years ago! LOL Still, if I could do it, so can you.

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 07:46 am: Edit

Thx a lot Alexandre. To tell you the truth, I have been really loosing hope in Penn being an international applicant. Could you please give me some numbers as to make me feel less nervous.

The deadline for applications is Nov. 1 and i'm already freaking out! What's the acceptance rate for international applicants if you know..or just guess?

If you don't mind me asking..what were you grades, scores, and EC like so I can know what to shoot for because you're obviously by goal due to how similar we are!...Thx a lot for all of this help!

I appreciate it so much!

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 08:07 am: Edit

GPA: 3.5
SAT: 1540
AP: Eight 5s in Macro-Econ, Micro-Econ, Math BC, Physics AB, French, English, US History and European History.
ECs: Theater and Tennis.

I was admitted into all the schools I applied to except UNC-Chapel Hill. Those b@stards rejected me. I picked Michigan-Ann Arbor over 8 other schools, including Cal-Berkeley (my second choice), Northwestern (my third choice), Chicago (my fourth choice), Columbia, Cornell, Penn, Brown and Georgetown. I recommend you apply to Michigan as well as Penn.

Penn, the Wharton school in particular, is mega-selective. I would say that to have a shot at getting in today, you need a mix between a high GPA (at least 3.7), good SAT (over 750 in math and over 600 in the verbal), good ECs and excellent essays. Even then, the odds aren't good. But there are several excellent options. If you want to study business, I recommend you look at Michigan-Ann Arbor, MIT, Cal-Berkeley, NYU and Georgetown.

If you decide to apply to Michigan, make sure you send your application by the first week of October at the latest.

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 08:48 am: Edit

Wow Alexandre, that list of acceptances is very impressive...WOW!!!

congratulations (even if it's 12 yrs late.)

Thx for the advice, i'll try my best and i will apply to all the schools you mentioned. Most were already on my list except would Williams also be a good choice?

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 08:50 am: Edit

Williams is awesome. Let me understand though...what is it you want to study? What do you wish to do with your degree?

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 09:11 am: Edit

I'm interested in a business degree because I believe that I would enjoy myself best in the business world because of my obvious interest in the corporate world. I narrowed my interests to this because of how I enjoy a fast paced life where I have to work to earn my money and not hope for big breaks to strike fortune. I do not want to be a "wage-slave" and am thus looking at a business opportunity with a lot of bonuses depending on how much I work.
I therefore look at Investment Banking. I want to go to the school that would provide me the best opportunity for recruitment to a good banking firm such as Goldman Sachs etc... I want to make enough money there, hopefully get an MBA in business, then go on to start up my own business after I have "collected" enough money.
I'm looking at the top schools because they all provide the best on-campus recruitment after graduation. Wharton seems to fit above all of them and that is why i'm applying ED.
I have no family in the US except for strong family friends in Philadelphia and have many other reasons to go to Penn and that is why I was asking for advice on that school. I understand that it is extremely selective, but I believe that Wharton will provide me the best opportunities for after-graduation recruitment.

sorry for the long post...lol...It's just that I can relate so much to you that i'm telling you everything!

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 09:14 am: Edit

Here are my stats as of now. could you please tell me what I have to improve etc...or just give me an overlook on how you see it and what stands out etc...

International Student

Sat 1: 1400 M: 720 V:680
Sat 2: Biology: 700 French: 730 APUS: 680
Will take Writing and Math in the next dates.
TOEFL: To be taken in 2 weeks.

APs: (8 Aps offered at the school in total.)
Biology: 4
APUS: 4
English language: Senior Year
Spanish Language: "
Calculus AB: "
Macro and Micro Economics: "

GPA: 3.81, Hardest Courseload.

Rank: No rank is done at my school.

E.C.
Varsity Soccer (3 yrs)
Varsity Volleyball (2 yrs)
Varsity Badminton (3 yrs)
Emirates Youth Symphony Orchestra (8 yrs)(violin)
- This is very serious because we have played for the Sheikhs of Oman, United Arab Emirates, Kuwait, Bahrain and have traveled to PAris to play in EuroDisney and played in the music festival in Prague.
International Honor Band (clarinet, 4 yrs)
-This is serious as well, as every year, students from all American International Schools in the entire world send in audition tapes to the Hague to be selected into Honor Band. I was selected for 4 years in a row as a first seat clarinet.
Habitat for Humanity (Tanzania)
Go to Tanzania to do community service work in a small town, Korogwe, and help build houses and other chores. Community service should come from that
-1 Internship at a company here in Dubai. Internships are extremely hard to find because this country is very strict on its laws, and one of them states that 18yrs old is the age that work is permitted; ie internships. you might say that i got connections to have earned this internship..lol.
NHS (3yrs)
This is not the cheap everybody moans about, but instead is a major chapter at our school, where you have to apply, get teacher recs, and have a certain GPA and EC to get in. (Hopefully become an officer next year.)

REcs and Essays: I can't really say that they will be outstanding or horrible, but I will say that a lot of efforts would be put into them to make them stand out.

I will be applying ED to Wharton (if my chances are ok,) and will be sending a supp. CD of me playing the violin and clarinet.

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 09:38 am: Edit

I already told a few students that you do not need to be a Business major to get a job with an Investment Bank. In fact, a significant percentage of new hires at major investment banks each year major in subjects such as Economics, English, International Relations, Languages and Political Science. Most IB want talented young people who can travel, are well read, know how to deal with people from all walks of life etc... You have to have a good quantitative side. Your math, statitics and computer skills have to be quite advanced, and your understanding of the market has to be somewhat good. But that is the only requirement.

This said, I suggest you look into the following schools and decide which ones you like best from a personal point of view. Then decide what you need to do at those schools to reach your career goals:

Amherst
Brown
Cal-Berkeley
Chicago
Columbia
Cornell
Dartmouth
Duke
Georgetown
Harvard
Haverford
Johns Hopkins
Michigan-Ann Arbor
MIT
New York University
Northwestern
Penn
Princeton
Stanford
Swarthmore
Texas-Austin
Vassar
Williams
Yale

I have provided you with a link below. That will transport you to a page that shows you where Goldman Sachs recruits directly. As you can see, the list above pretty much matches that list. Most investment banks have a similar list.

http://www.iie.org/Template.cfm?&Template=/programs/global_leaders/universities.htm

You can major in anything at any of those schools and if you take the right balance of courses and try hard enough, you will get a job with a good IB. That includes taking a few classes in economics, accounting, claculus, statistics and computers, and interning at least 2 summers at Investment Banks. Make sure you hone your French skills, it will prove invaluable to you.

Obviously, getting a degree in Finance at Wharton or NYU helps your chances, but only if you know that is what you want to do. As you can see, you have several options, and it really boils down to picking the path that best corresponds to your nature.

So, study the 25 or so universities above, pick 7 or 8 that you really like, and apply to them. Then pick a couple of safeties from outside this list because I assure you, no matter how good you are, the schools above are all reaches or matches. Good safeties for a person with your excellent credentials would be Wisconsin-Madison or Indiana-Bloomington.

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 10:04 am: Edit

All right.
Thx a lot for all of this advice, and as you inform me more and more, I see how IB would be good for me. So I can basically go to any of those excellent universities listed, study what i want but have a basis in economics, accounting, calculus, statistics and computers, and intern at at least 2 Investment Banks and I should be on my way then...ok...seems like the best advice i've received.
Thank you very much for all of your help Alexandre!

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 02:21 pm: Edit

Alexandre... I have another simple yet number driven question that you may find cliche due to how naive it may sound...sorry about this...but

Which college/university will be the top feeder and a core on-campus recruitment upon graduation to the top investment banking firms?
I understand that all those schools listed above are top feeders, but which are better concerning a national university, a LAC? And therefore, thus majoring in business help in recruitment, give an advantage per say, than going to an LAC and getting the basis and continuing with what interests me?

I have heard many theories...some say that wharton is the top feeder because after getting a BS in Business, it is the top-feeder for IB...and others stating that Williams is better because since it is an LAC, IB prefer graduates from there due their strong sense of the arts etc...and that they would be stronger candidates that graduates from Wharton???Is this true?

thx for your help.

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 03:14 pm: Edit

I will have to go with Wharton, although Williams and Amherst are certainly not far behin. But Wharton is a major hunting ground. Each year, Wharton graduates 400 Finance majors. That is HUGE. That's the size of Williams' ENTIRE graduating class. Why should investment banks god anywhere else?

But like I said, it really depends on what type of education you want. If you want a more traditional, intellectually charged undergraduate education, don't go to Penn. Go to Chicago, Amherst or Williams.

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 03:21 pm: Edit

Ok..sure that Wharton graduates 400 Finance Majors, but considering that their are more students at Wharton then Williams, wouldn't numbers be an unfair assumption? and instead? percentages?

I understand why Wharton would the top feeder, but considering IB recruitment in percentages, wouldn't Williams students have a higher chance of being recruited than Wharton students because of competition between themselves?

How far ahead is on-campus recruitment at Wharton than at Williams or Amherst? Is it considerally far ahead? Or ahead by a small margin that it is better off going to a top LAC to study what I want.

ANd How about georgetown...i heard that they are a top-feeder as well...why is that?

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 04:18 pm: Edit

In terms of percentages, I would still say that Wharton is #1. Too many Wharton alums in high places on Wall Street for it not to count. After that, I would say that MIT, Michigan-
Ann Arbor and Cal-Berkeley are next among Business schools. Amherst and Williams among LACs. The rest of the Ivy League, Stanford, Chicago and Northwestern for the rest. Georgetown is lower in the pecking order. But it is really Wharton and then all the rest.

At any rate, here is how I would say Investment banks would rate top hunting grounds:

If I had to recommend Business schools, I would say go with this order:
#1 Wharton
#2 MIT
#3 Michigan-Ann Arbor
#4 Cal-Berkeley
#5 NYU
#6 Carnegie Mellon
#7 UVA or UT-Austin

If I were to pick universities for social sciences or humanities, I would go with the following groups:
Group I:
Harvard
MIT
Princeton
Stanford
Yale

Group II
Amherst
Brown
Cal-Berkeley
Chicago
Columbia
Cornell
Darmouth
Duke
Michigan-Ann Arbor
Northwestern
Penn
Williams

Group III:
Carleton
Davidson
Georgetown
Haverford
Johns Hopkins
New York University
Notre Dame
Oberlin
Pomona
Swarthmore
Texas-Austin
Vassar
Virginia
Wesleyan


There are plenty of other schools mind you. But those are the big hunting grounds.

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 04:30 pm: Edit

ok..thx a lot Alexandre for all this information once again!

You have helped me get a college list and know where I want to go! all i have to decide is where to apply early to increase my chances...Thx a lot once again!

you have been the best help here so far!

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Sunday, July 25, 2004 - 08:21 pm: Edit

Hi,
it's me again. Maybe my question is weird but which part of my profile is the strongest point, in your opinion??

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 02:09 am: Edit

Trialboy, you have many strengths. Your GPA is good, your SATIIs are solid and your SAT math is good. Your ECs are also good and your Math Olympiad is very impressive.

Your only weakness may be your SAT verbal, but they will understand because you are not a native English speaker.

On the whole, your numbers, stats, scores etc... are on target. What will make the difference is your essays. You have to set yourself appart by being true to yourself and coming accross as genuine, confident and hungry (for a challenge and for knowledge).

Make sure you apply to a healthy mix of reaches (at least 3), matches (at least 3) and safeties (at least 2). Come back to this forum when you have done your research and let us know which universities you have decided to apply to and we will give you our opinion.

Good luck!

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 02:19 am: Edit

Marc, good luck selecting universities. Let us know your final list so that we can give you advice. If you need to brainstorm, feel free to call. My cell phone is 050-612-4303

Good luck!

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 02:31 am: Edit

ok

First of all, i'm sorry Trialboy for having taken over this thread a little bit, but this should be the last question.

Thx a lot Alexandre for all of this and the cell phone number. I'm off two get 2 wisdom teeth removed right now...ARGH. Just more trouble. sigh.

I have finalized my college list to an enormous amount of reaches (6-7) and am debating where to apply EArly. Williams or Wharton. I know that they are both extreme reaches and very different school, the most different i assume, but their are qualities in each that outweight all other unis for me.

My question is, which of these two would I stand a higher chance? Which one will favor my application more (meaning that since Williams is "jocky," would that put me at an advantage?)

And what should I improve on my app. to make myself a stronger candidate to these schools?

Or if worse is to worse and that I have no shot at either two? Just tell me...

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 02:54 am: Edit

Marc, we are best served having this conversation the phone given the fact that we both live in the same city. But I would say that your EA chances at Williams are better...if you are the right fit. There is little you can do to improve. Your SAts are solid, as are your grades. What will make or break you are your essays. That is the case with elite private universities. You see, the acceptance rate for people with a 1500+ at Williams is not much higher than it is for people with a 1400. I would say 30% compared to 20%. What makes the difference is the "fit".

Anyway, good luck with your operation (I had all 4 wisdom teeth removed at once about 8 years ago!), and let us know the rest of the schools you wish to apply to. And like I said, call me if you wish.

By Marc_Posth (Marc_Posth) on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 04:33 am: Edit

k..i guess i'll call you sometime soon then to talk about this...but when do are you free to talk about such things?

The last thing I want to do is call you when you're busy or in the middle of a meeting...

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Monday, July 26, 2004 - 09:10 am: Edit

I am free anytime after 7:00 PM.

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 06:13 am: Edit

Hi,

It's me again. Could you suggest some more university lists but for California and New York/New Jersey

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Friday, July 30, 2004 - 07:21 am: Edit

Here you go. Schools according to state. All those schools should offer some financial aid, but you want to do your research as to which ones offer enough. They are located in the States that you seem to favor. I left our the Chicago and Texas areas. Schools with *** next to them indicate top 5 CS departments. Schools with * next to them mean they are top 25 but not top 5 in CS.

CALIFORNIA:
Caltech*
Calremont MacKenna
Harvey Mudd*
Occidental
Pomona
Santa Clara University
Stanford***

CONNECTICUT:
Wesleyan University*

MASSACHUSETTS:
Amherst
MIT ***
Williams

NEW JERSEY:
Princeton*
Stevens Institute of Technology *

NEW YORK:
Clarkson University
Columbia
Cooper Union (tuition = $0)
Cornell *** (the best in NY for CS)
Hamilton
New York University
Union College **
Vassar

PENNSYLVANIA:
Carnegie Mellon ***
Swarthmore *

RHODE ISLAND:
Brown University*

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Saturday, July 31, 2004 - 07:12 pm: Edit

Hi,
It's me again. Could you tell me what reasonable financial aid for an applicant with my profile can be offered. I mean that there should be something like a limit for my financial need - for example if I need 20,000 it'll be OK but if I need 30,000 it'll be "too much". I'm asking about the first 7 universities in your list.

Thanks!

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Saturday, July 31, 2004 - 07:17 pm: Edit

If you can afford $20,000/year, you should be able to find a few schools.

Let me recommend you apply to a bunch of schools above. You need to do research on how to go about getting Financial Aid. I hear that if you apply Early Decision/Action, the chances of getting aid are increased. But also apply to two other schools...not in California and not in NY/NJ. The schools are in Texas.

Rice University Much cheaper than other privates and will give good financial aid.
University of Texas-Austin (total package will cose about $20,000/year)

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Saturday, July 31, 2004 - 08:12 pm: Edit

A few schools...? Could you be more precize:)
yeah, I'm joking but really - which shools do you count? Also does this mean that if I can afford, let's say, $10,000 per year, it'll minimize my chances? I wonder is there a certain $number above which the admission office says "Oh, come on, he's not Einstein!". I know that my question may sound naive but there should be a ballance b/n the profile and the amount of money needed - I want to find what is it in my case.

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Sunday, August 01, 2004 - 06:09 am: Edit

Hey, Alexandre,
I forgot to thank you about everything! You gave me the most valuable information in my research so far. By the way, why don't you publish a handbook for "applying to universities" - it'll be a bestseller, I'm sure:) !!
Thanks again!

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, August 01, 2004 - 07:35 am: Edit

I meant a "few schools" from the list above. I have friends who got scholarship money from MIT and Northwestern. I know they give out money. Some will offer more fiancnial aid than others. You need to do your research. See which ones offer more money to international students for example. Rice is about $10,000/year cheaper than most other private universities and they give out money too. The University of Texas at Austin costs under $20,000 anyway.

And I AM writing a book on universities. But I do not intend to publish it. I will use it as a reference guide when I start my college consulting business!

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Sunday, August 01, 2004 - 10:01 am: Edit

Yes, I'm researching but I can't find any information about the number and the amount of the given scholarships/fin aid. I think it will be helpful if I find which are the most commonly given aids to internationals in the researched universities and also what amount of money they give out rarely. Do you think that such information is available? Because I haven't found anything so far. Also, do you think that I should ask the admission/financial aid office directly or it'll be a wasting of time?

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, August 01, 2004 - 10:09 am: Edit

You are probably better off asking people in the Financial Aid board. I am not well versed in to matters. As a rule of thumb, Private universities give out more money, but they are more expensive, so it all balances out in the end.

I know there are difference between the various schools. For example, some schools give more scholarship money to those who apply early decision/action.

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Sunday, August 01, 2004 - 11:08 am: Edit

So, can you suggest any reasonable sum which would match with my scores/profile. I mean a scholarship/financial aid which I could ask from the universities (chiefly Stanford, Princeton, Cornell).

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Sunday, August 01, 2004 - 11:29 am: Edit

I am afraid I am not sure what sort of money you can get. Like I said, this is one aspect I know very little about. You will have to apply and see. I think Princeton gives out a lot of money, but your SATs may be a little low for them.

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Sunday, August 01, 2004 - 11:45 am: Edit

OK, thanks anyway!
I'll try to find some information and I'll share it with you.

By Upandover (Upandover) on Monday, August 02, 2004 - 12:39 am: Edit

Stanford and Cornell are very stingy with international students, Princeton very generous.

I'm not talking about the amount of money they give you, but rather in terms of admissions. You stand a far far lower chance at Stanford and Cornell should you apply for aid.

The amount of money they give you depends on what you need.. you can't ask for an amount, and they just give it to you.

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Monday, August 02, 2004 - 06:25 am: Edit

Yale, a?!:)
Congratulations! I don't know whether you applied for financial aid or not but if you have any information, please, name any other "very generous" (or not so very) universities. From the Alexandre's list, if possible .
Thanks!

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Monday, August 02, 2004 - 06:17 pm: Edit

Alexandre, what would you say about Trinity College?

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Monday, August 02, 2004 - 06:54 pm: Edit

And for the Rochester Institute of Technology - I think it was in the top 5 of USA technical schools two years ago.

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 12:26 am: Edit

Those two schools (Trinity and Rochester I. T.)are fine, but not as good as some of the other schools you seemed interested in.

Rochester is rated #77 in the US for Engineering. The rankings are not always accurate, but even if it is better than #77, how much better can it be?

Trinity College is really not known for Technical fields. Last time I checked, over 60% of the students majored in Economics, Political Science, English, History and Psychology.

By Upandover (Upandover) on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 01:25 am: Edit

In Alexandre's list... only this schools are generous.. Cooper Union is not free for internationals (I think!)

MASSACHUSETTS:

MIT ***
Williams

NEW JERSEY:
Princeton*

It would STILL be hard to get in, but your chances of admission does not differ (much) from other internationals who DO NOT NEED AID.

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 01:38 am: Edit

Cooper Union is free for all, but the cost of living in New York makes up for it! LOL

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 05:47 am: Edit

I was thinking - is it possible to apply ED in a university and, if not accepted, to apply in the RD after that?

By Cooldude (Cooldude) on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 12:13 pm: Edit

Princeton university, is the best college which has a high ED acceptance rate.

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Thursday, August 05, 2004 - 07:59 pm: Edit

I'll apply to Princeton ED. Do I have to raise my SAT I score?

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Thursday, August 05, 2004 - 08:00 pm: Edit

If yes - how much should I raise it??
Thanks!

By Trialboy (Trialboy) on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 09:54 am: Edit

I forgot to tell you "Please" :)

By Arcadia (Arcadia) on Friday, August 06, 2004 - 11:38 am: Edit

Also look into Middlebury if you're into humanities. They are one of the few colleges that are need blind to international applicants.


Report an offensive message on this page    E-mail this page to a friend
Posting is currently disabled in this topic. Contact your discussion moderator for more information.

Administrator's Control Panel -- Board Moderators Only
Administer Page