Does URM or first gen really matter in admissions?

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Discus: What Are My Chances?: April 2004 Archive: Does URM or first gen really matter in admissions?
By J2005 (J2005) on Monday, April 05, 2004 - 05:38 pm: Edit

I'm just wondering cause i fit both of those categories. While by no means do i wish to use it as crutch, I would still like to know more regarding how they are considered (esp. 1st Gen) You can break them up into individual schools or sections (ie top 25, ivy) if you wish.

Thank You

By J2005 (J2005) on Monday, April 05, 2004 - 09:28 pm: Edit

crackity jones! (translation: BUMP!)

By Culovv (Culovv) on Monday, April 05, 2004 - 09:43 pm: Edit

Me =

3.3 UW at prep school with no rank but it would be decent if we didnt deflate to hell
First gen

Rejected - Cornell, Berkeley, UCLA, UCSD, UCSB.
Waitlisted - WUSTL and Carleton

URM + first gen = WAY over-estimated.

By Tallyrand (Tallyrand) on Monday, April 05, 2004 - 10:19 pm: Edit

The whole URM/first gen matter is overestimated at most top institutions, while the legacy business is actually underestimated, in my opinion. Most colleges are not taking grossly underqualified URMs and first gen's. HYPSC understand that URMs and first gen's have something unique to bring to the table, so they'd take a first generation college going Puerto Rican over a white guy from a Massachusetts prep school IF and only IF the two were equally qualified in other respects.

HYSPC have the advantage of getting an application from essentially every single top student in the country. However, some colleges that are slightly less well known(but are still very good) need to accept less qualified URMs to keep up a non-homogeneous student body. Check the stats at the schools you're interested in. The lower the figure for the minority group you're from, the more likely your ethnic background will work in your favor when applying.

By Haithman (Haithman) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 01:03 am: Edit

Actually it does give you an edge, esecially if you are an URM with reasonably high scores. Something like 70 Black/African American students (yea us!) scored a 1500+ last year...70! Along with the SAT you also have to look at other factors. Culovv you did have excellent SAT scores, but you GPA was not very spectacular and it may have been hard for those top notch colleges to see past that. But an URM with lets say 1450-1500 SAT scores, 3.75 UW GPA, multiple EC's and great essays will have a much easier time getting into selective colleges than a caucasian or Asian with the same stats.

By Slayer (Slayer) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 08:32 am: Edit


By Tunan_Fish (Tunan_Fish) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 01:07 pm: Edit

Unequivocally yes.

Being a URM has been shown to have the same effect as having your SAT-I score raised 400 points, when it comes to college admissions.

By Haithman (Haithman) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 01:32 pm: Edit

Holy Shite 400 pts!!! So if I score a 1500 its like getting a 1900?! lol
I always thought it was like 100 pts not 400 but maybe I thought wrong.

By Neo (Neo) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 01:59 pm: Edit

Haha...what a load of poo.

400 points? Get real.

By Candi1657 (Candi1657) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 02:24 pm: Edit

There isn't really a hard fast say add 100 or 400 points. The weight of URM status differs from school to school and generally, URM applicants are compared to other URM applicants at that particular school. For example, at HYP this year, it was hard for 1300-1400 scoring URMs, but other schools would snatch up those students in a minute.

By Perintastic (Perintastic) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 03:08 pm: Edit

my mom was a first-generation turkish kid (she actually spent most of her childhood there, although she was born here). she wrote her essays on it and everything. she barely broke 1000 on her SAT (never broke 500 on verbal) and had a 3.4 GPA and swears on her life she got into NYU and cornell.

i think she's full of crap though...especially about cornell...cuz if she'd gone in, knowing my grandparents, she would have gone there. and hello, cornell doesn't take barely-10somethings on the SAT.

By Northstarmom (Northstarmom) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 07:00 pm: Edit

Being first generation college or a URM is a hook, but even if such a student has great stats, they still aren't guaranteed top college admissions. They just face a little better odds than would many other students.

Students who are URM, first generation college who kiss off their essays, don't retake mediocre SATs, ask for recommendations at the last minute because they assume they are shoo-ins for admission are likely to be very disappointed come April (as is the case with most students who do those kind of self defeating things).

By Robert456 (Robert456) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 07:02 pm: Edit

URM > first generation

By Stargzrlilychk1 (Stargzrlilychk1) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 07:50 pm: Edit

damn, why!!! i think personally that first generation should be more important. if you want to talk about being from a disadvantaged background, try having parents who have absolutely no clue about the admissions process and want you to skip college and go to work ;)

By Haithman (Haithman) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 08:01 pm: Edit

Well I am an URM and first generation. It is evident that they are first gen..just two nights ago when we were at dinner my father said "Score 1500 on your SAT and Harvard will take you for free.." I looked up from my plate and gave off a mild smile while thinking "You obviously dont know about CC" lol

By Valducky (Valducky) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 08:06 pm: Edit

The benefits of URM is not really about being disadvantaged. It is more important for a college to have a diverse student body.

btw, Legacy sure kicks ass at Stanford :-)

By Jolt21 (Jolt21) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 09:09 pm: Edit

i am URM and first gen...with a 30 ACT and a 1240 SAT, Dartmouth sent me a likely deferred from Brown ED, but raised ACT to a 35 and got in RD..i got into every college i applied to..and out of 8 schools, i only showed the 35 to 4 of them..the rest saw the 30/1240 and still took me...i think URM and first gen help enough

By Serdu (Serdu) on Tuesday, April 06, 2004 - 10:37 pm: Edit

It *does* help, but some believe that if you're a URM your an auto-admit. When in actuality, URM's are accepted at a 25% rate or so @ HYP. I had decent scores and (I've posted this millions of times before) a 760 in Writing w/ a 12 on the essay.

I was *told* that that type of writing score among non-native English speakers (Esp. Hispanics?) is rare. But I'm sure there are plenty who scored at least that. I also taught myself French and managed a decent score. (I was also the first student to pass that AP exam at my school since 1988). At any rate, I think the admissions process went well for me NOT because of my scores,GPA, or rank, but my essays. They were very "poetic" according to my APEL teacher. They also described some pretty harsh stuff I've been through. My advice to EVERYONE is that they make essays a top priority.

By Haithman (Haithman) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 12:53 am: Edit

Fellow URM I know in at Wharton with 3.69 GPA and 1330 SAT. Lazy student but I dont know if that has any relevancy. So yeah I guess it does help, I dont know of many of my White or Asian friends (or other people) Who got/get into Wharton with those stats.

By Tallyrand (Tallyrand) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 02:13 am: Edit

Just curious Haithman...are you Haitian, by any chance?

By Haithman (Haithman) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 02:18 am: Edit

No, in my profile it says African/Middle Eastern
My name is Haitham so I thought I would just make my name on here Haithman. Thought it was clever at the time...

By Tallyrand (Tallyrand) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 03:17 am: Edit

Oh, that's cool. I knew somebody named Haitham at CTY a few years back. I'm Caribbean myself, so I'm always on the lookout for others of my kind, hehe. Ah well.

By Jolt21 (Jolt21) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 10:20 am: Edit

im haitian!

By Dumbgirl (Dumbgirl) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 02:14 pm: Edit

Quick question: Would being Asian help at a school with a 2% Asian population? The wierd thing is, its ranked 99 in terms of selectivity, but the Asian population is miniscule. Its also top 10 in US News.

By Elzbieta777 (Elzbieta777) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 02:23 pm: Edit

what school is this?

By Dumbgirl (Dumbgirl) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 02:41 pm: Edit

a really really good one with a ridculously good asian percentage, so hopefully that will boost my chances up

By _Failure (_Failure) on Wednesday, April 07, 2004 - 04:53 pm: Edit

Hey culovv, how come you applied transfer to Cal Poly?

By Infinity (Infinity) on Thursday, April 08, 2004 - 10:59 am: Edit

What does it mean to be URM? If my parents were not born in the US, but came to here to get their master's, am I still first gen? If I am, there must be many first gen asians.

By Northstarmom (Northstarmom) on Thursday, April 08, 2004 - 11:55 am: Edit

You are not first generation college. Your parents have been to college. "First generation college" means the applicant first in their family to go to college anywhere.

If you are Hispanic or black, you possibly may qualify as being an underrepresented minority.

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