Am I screwed?





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Discus: What Are My Chances?: September 2003 Archive: Am I screwed?
By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 04:35 pm: Edit

I just found out that my school's salutatorian is also applying to Duke ED, should I kiss my dream of going there goodbye? If you've read my recent posts, you should have an idea of what my stats are. If you haven't gotten the chance yet, here is a brief synopsis:
1500SATI
750 SAT II's 3 each
4.15 GPA weighted and 10% of class
JV Tennis and Bowling
SOme volunteering awards and EC's

This girl has a 1430 SATI, 2 in class with like 4.6GPA, VARSITY Soccer, Softball, and Swimming all four years. Many leadership roles and student congress positions. ALso, her aunt and uncle are alumni from duke. In other words, I am Volkswagon and she is a Ferrari. Am I done for?

By Magenta (Magenta) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 04:43 pm: Edit

Ask your school counselor if they have ever had two students from your school accepted to Duke ED in the same year. If it isn't considered unethical, ask if she/he can give you any idea if other students still are planning to apply to Duke ED. And this may seem really crazy, but can students like yourself contact the admissions people at the schools like are interested in and ask them flat out, "What do you think my odds are here given that this gal with XYZ is also applying for my school? I won't ask you to place any bets, of course, but if I were your kid here, would you bother to have me spend the time and money to apply at all and would applying ED be best?"

By Alimshk (Alimshk) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 05:08 pm: Edit

You're screwed.

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 05:14 pm: Edit

I kind of figured that. Alimshk you are always pessimistic so I don't care what you think...GRR. I want TheDad of Sluggbugg to answer, they will tell me the truth.

By Quakerboy2 (Quakerboy2) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 05:33 pm: Edit

It just depends on your school. This year, my best friend went to Duke, and there was somebody else who also went (with higher class rank), and my friend had about the same stats as you. It just depends on how willing Duke seems to be about taking more than one (or two...or three..or more) from your school.

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 05:40 pm: Edit

Okay thanks. My school is the twelfth best public school in New Jersey. Not quite a magnet, but I would say that is better than average...

By Sostressedout (Sostressedout) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 05:50 pm: Edit

you kno 6 ppl got accepted to duke from my school last year, so i dont think u should worry abt that, ur stats look great

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 06:23 pm: Edit

Still apply. Last year the valedictorian of my daughter's school applied to Harvard, as did the student ranked number 5. The valedictorian's sat's and gpa were higher BUT the lower ranked student has better extracurriculars (still great stats though). The Val did not get into Harvard but the number 5 student did. You just never know what's going to convince adcom's to choose someone.

By Ahlawahed (Ahlawahed) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 06:56 pm: Edit

Colleges don't take one student from every school, they take the best out of who applied! At my school we had a couple people go to one ivy and schools like them. Not one person only

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 07:02 pm: Edit

Okay, thanks a lot you guys. My stupid friends got me into a frenzy saying that there was no way that both of us could go to Duke!

By Quakerboy2 (Quakerboy2) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 08:37 pm: Edit

Yeah, you can both def. go to Duke.

Careful, though, Ahlawahed, colleges do take a look at where they are accepting people from and try not to take too many from the same school in any given year. The more selective the college, the more this applies. If you have a group of fantastically qualified applicants, they will probably all get in, but people who might have gotten in other years will probably not get in if there are already 5 other definite accepts to, say, Stanford.

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 08:39 pm: Edit

This is Duke...haha. I am probably 10 or 11 in my class, so I only expect possibly one other threat besides the salutatorian.

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 08:40 pm: Edit

boy that puts you on a bad possition im so glad no one but me is considering going to the USA to study hehe:), but still it wouldnt mater if they did cus im the valedictorian:)
but any ways good luck!
but wait your not completely screwed just wrtie excelent essays!! and work on your ec's list and get amazing recommendations

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Tuesday, September 09, 2003 - 08:55 pm: Edit

Grrr, you valedictorian....

In our school, the girl with the smartest friends is valedictorian. They give her notes, answers to tests, etc. The guys are competitive and won't help each other cheat. Thus, 12 out of the top 15 people are girls...

By Serdu (Serdu) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 01:19 pm: Edit

Interesting, most top 10% are girls. Iam not a girl, but I am at least #2, AS is my competitor (#1).Actually, I don't know anymore who is ranked what.

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 03:17 pm: Edit

Haha. Our school has a whole cheating network. How can you compete with a girl who studies perfect notes that were taken from the teacher verbatim and know half of the test before she takes it??

The truth came out when we got our SAT scores. The boys in the 20s and 30s all got 1450+ and the top 2 girls were at the low 1400s. Too bad their friends couldn't help them cheat with that...

The top guy got a 1600 and is only like 8 or 9, I got a 1500 and am like 12 or 13.

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 05:05 pm: Edit

i dont cheat the truth is that girls at my school are uh well i wouldnt say smart but they dont really put enough effort in their studies , seriosly i have a 98% and the following gpa is like a 88%

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 05:14 pm: Edit

great job on ur sat!!!! 1500 is something to be freaking proud of;)
may i ask which books did you use to prepare for the sat ??

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 05:23 pm: Edit

You can ask and I can tell. I didn't use any books, I got tutored in verbal for a year! Did nothing in math. My verbal went from a 530 to a 720 so it was worth it!!!

By Magenta (Magenta) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 06:10 pm: Edit

My guess is that girls in general (not all by any means, but in general) have higher GPAs (which they keep over males in college, in case you didn't know) because they spend more time on school work, have better organizational skills (due mostly to wanting to teacher please more than innate or learned techniques or the like), and put a higher priority on their GPA than due males in general. My brother is a very sharp guy (780 math before recentering, which is like an 800 or better since they made the math easier) who nearly flunked 12th grade as he could care less about English (which was taught by a woman who had graduated from that same high school a few years earlier and was having affairs with lots of the boys in her classes, though not my brother, likely to his dismay). He has easy A's in calculus (highest math course taught in high schools back then) and things like physics were very easy for him, but he simply could care less about his grades and was a B student overall. Once he started college, though, that all changed and he graduated magna cum laude (3.8+ GPA) with degrees in physics and EE while also being pre-med (had about 180 credits in 4 years). In college, he gave a ...well, you know. I think this business of males being bored in school (smart ones especially) and just not caring to be a teacher's pet or whatever is far more common in males than females as I see it over and over again in them.

Males today (not sure about decades ago) do seem to care about the SAT far more than a GPA, and this is likely a time put in to gain acquired thing - they see it doesn't usually take that long to raise their scores and are willing to put in that effort, and it's usually needed in verbal for males far more than math as after puberty, the males get an edge in mathematical thinking *in general* (I say this as the daughter of a female mathematician, mind you) and so the math section is often quite easy for them. Females, I suspect, tend to read more than males *in general* and thus have a better starting (i.e. no effort applied) verbal score.

Someone wrote that girls aren't that smart and just share notes, whatever to get higher grades where males are more competitive and won't share anything. This can actually work against males in the work place, where cooperative work often (again, not always) is key in getting things done and getting promotions. One reason our species has all the culture, knowledge, technological advances, etc. that it does is due to our ability and willingness to share information with others in the species such that one thing can build on another far easier than if everyone lived alone in a cabin in the woods with no Internet or snail mail.

I fail to see (and maybe I just missed the specifics?) where girls sharing notes taken verbatim from a lecturing teacher (if that's how she knew half the test before she took it?) is cheating, BTW. I've never heard of a teacher saying you can't show class notes to anyone else - it's homework that often isn't to be shared (and in college, our son has a physics professor who insists *all* students SHOULD be checking their homework answers before turning them in and there is never an excuse for not having a 100% on homework as if one is discussing the problems enough, the right answers should be come to, and so there is no such thing as cheating on homework, where on tests, there can be cheating).

Hspimpson, I agree that you should be proud of the 1500, especially since you had to WORK to get the verbal score rather than just having it come naturally. It's not just the ends someone should be proud of (indeed, sometimes, I don't even think they should be proud of the ends), but the effort.

By Aspirer42 (Aspirer42) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 06:11 pm: Edit

Our valedictorian was given in-school suspension for cheating in his freshman year and got arrested for underage drinking last year. Not like the colleges he's applying to are ever going to know that...

EDIT: Heh, and I just remembered we're both applying to Duke. He literally has almost no extracurriculars to speak of, though.

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 06:36 pm: Edit

Well, I saw the Valedictorian asking her friend what was on the test as soon as she got out of the classroom...

Magenta, those were very wise words. I had come to the conclusion that girls were stupid but just worked hard (from my school), but people like you constantly prove me wrong. I hate that though. The girls are so nice to the teachers and in return they get whatever they want.

Aspirer, me is applying to Duke (obviously), what are your stats? Are you going ED? We aren't really competing because you are going for an in-state spot, but I would still like to know.

I can only hope that the girls at my university are as bright as you. Rather than the airheads who take good notes in my school.


I think it is also imasculating for me to get beaten by a girl. I know that's terrible, but let me explain. Throughout all of school, I was always in an inner circle of like 5 really smart guys. Then they left our public high school to go to an academy. I thought that I would be valedictorian hands-down. I didn't even bother studying and then I realized that all these girls who were never even in honors classes were beating me. I would hate losing to a guy too, just don't like losing. ALthough, there is one guy that I am willing to admit is way smarter than me.

By Tsdad (Tsdad) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 06:47 pm: Edit

To the OP:

My son's school had six seniors decide to go to Penn this fall. That's six out of thirty who applied to American universities. His school doesn't do class rank. So I don't think your screwed. Your credentials stand on their own, but you really need to work on your attitude.

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 07:03 pm: Edit

Thanks. I know, I didn't word it correctly. I know that there are many girls that are way smarter than me. I have no problem being beaten by a girl. What upsets me is that these girls AREN'T smarter than me. It's upsetting that they have way better GPA's when I know I could beat them in any subject easily (except English). The worst part is that it was unexpected. I never paid attention to their grades until we got class rank. Then I was shocked.

By Magenta (Magenta) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 07:27 pm: Edit

Yes, asking what is on the test from someone who has already taken it is cheating. However, I doubt she could get much from it if it was just before she herself had to take it (which still doesn't make it right). But don't think only females pull this sh..well, you know. Our son took an upper level computer science course last semester where there was only a midterm and a final. The day of the midterm, a friend of his talked about how he knew every question on the test because his frat brothers had past copies and the professor never changed the midterm. Sure enough, the guy (and his frat buddies) got 100%, and this hurt other students as the curve got blown thanks to those guys. My husband heard about this from our son at dinner and really wanted our son to let the professor know his test is being passed around and to create a new midterm. I really felt our son would likely get an A all the same and to let others fight this battle (as I suspected if the guy blabbed to our son proudly about knowing the answers before the test, he would do the same to others in that class), though I felt for the others and wasn't sure what was the best move here. Luckily, our son got the high grade on the final and so indeed did get an A (seems the prof either caught on or typically uses a new final - not sure which, but that "100%" guy on the midterm had answers VERY different from our son as they discussed what they answered after the final and the other guy figured he blew a lot on the final).


Thanks for saying I have wise words (well, had them...my "wisdom" comes and goes!), but I'm not wise enough to get your drift here..."I had come to the conclusion that girls were stupid but just worked hard (from my school), but people like you constantly prove me wrong." How would people like myself prove you wrong? Did I note that I never worked hard (at least in this thread)? I don't remember noting that, though it was (still is) true. And I am not stupid, I grant, but not a 1500 SAT type, I assure you. :) But I suspect my mother would have been a 1600 type. She was both hard working and brilliant (that's the word people who knew her always used, and the display on her at this lobby at Hopkins 10 years after she died also had the title "Brilliance in Science" - which I found sort of odd as I never even thought of my mother as a scientist as her degrees were in math and statistics). I have a suspicion that her being hard working contributed to her somwhat early (age 52) demise to cancer, which is one reason I decided to become a complete bum. :O Anyway, there are certainly plenty of brilliant females in the world, and plenty of dumb males, too. ;) I have a weird theory that the smartest "group" are actually bisexuals (and no, I'm not one, nor is anyone in my family to my knowledge), though I base this on a VERY small sample. One of the only adults I know to have tested over 200 IQ is a married bi graduate of MIT (and he tells me there are LOTS of bi people there, and that's a school that attracts a lot of high IQ people), and if you read "Strange Brains and Genius", I think 7 of the 9 bios are of men who never married and while the author doesn't say he thinks these men were homosexual (the average IQ for homosexuals is abut 10 points higher than the general population, last I read many years ago) or bi, I have my suspicions. And I only knew one bi gal in college (rephrase: only one gal told me she was bi in college) and she seemed like she might have been the smartest female I met on campus. So anyhow, remember that you read that theory here first and we'll see if in years to come, it pans out to be accurate (as a theory I made at age 5 and everyone laughed at me for having concluded turned out about 20 years later to have been found dead on right).

And why do you hate being proven wronge about girls not being stupid? Do you plan on marrying someday, and if so, do you really want a gal who can't follow your jokes most of the time or whatever due to a lack of smarts? I don't think that would be worth feeling "masculine" after a time.

"The girls are so nice to the teachers and in return they get whatever they want." Again, there is a lesson to be learned here. No doubt your parents (likely mother ;]) told you that you get more with honey than with salt, and just being nice to people is no crime. But if this bothers you now, fasten your seatbelt for college as you will REALLY be gitting your teeth there, I suspect, as male professors often have affairs with their students or even give A's to girls for nothing more than them smiling at them (or wearing a low cut shirt and high skirt or short shorts). Sometimes these affairs go on without grades being the issue - a smart gal (who was sharing an apartment with a boyfriend yet) from my honors society was doing fine in this class and still was caught doing it in a closet in a college building with the professor (who was about 40 at the time and had a wife and three kids who I happened to see all eating out one night and had to grit MY teeth not to walk over and let the wife know what was going on, and to this day, I sort of curse myself for not doing it...I didn't even have that prof and so my grades weren't my issue there, just not wanting to get involved in literally other people's affairs). My friends and I never could figure out what was going on there as far as motivations were concerned.

What college(s) are you interested in attending? Do they have honor codes where you MUST report those you know are cheating or just ones where you promise not to cheat yourself and get your behind kicked out if you do (or so they say; a few have been from my son's university, but at least one professor, who is no longer there, used to just give students a zero for the test and tell them not to try throwing away their futures again)? The cheating (according to self-reports) is lower at the former and so if cheating is a hot issue with you, you might want to give those colleges an extra point in your weighing of choices, but only if you also don't mind having to turn in a frat brother or whoever whom you know is cheating - if you don't want to *have* to squeal on people you know, then you might want to give the latter a point.

By Magenta (Magenta) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 07:42 pm: Edit

"What upsets me is that these girls AREN'T smarter than me. It's upsetting that they have way better GPA's when I know I could beat them in any subject easily (except English)."

At least you know your one weakness (and overall, your English seems fine and likely better than most American females and males), but I had to smile at the above as it should be "smarter than *I*" as what you are saying is that "these girls aren't smarter than *I* am" - I have seen SO many people make that error and it is almost always while saying they are smart. :O The best one was this Harvard grad saying she was smarter than anyone else she ever met while studying there...I felt like writing her, "Yeah, well, at my state U, we knew when to use 'I' amd when to use 'me', which I guess they don't care about at Harvard." Of course, that wouldn't have been true, either, as most people who went to my state U likely make the same error, and I make it all the time in speaking (and even at my age, my father STILL corrects me each time I do this in front of him) and probably a fair share in writing, too.

And I used "due" rather than "do" and made who knows how many errors in a post earlier (please, nobody count and tell me...I really would rather remain ignorant).

"The worst part is that it was unexpected. I never paid attention to their grades until we got class rank. Then I was shocked."

Yes, not seeing a brick coming can hurt, but this wasn't really a brick, just a bee sting, so don't sweat it. My husband has a high school valedictorian aunt and a salutatorian mother and my mother was a valedictorian in her high school and would have also been in college had she not opted to take swimming there and that brother of mine who was a B student would be considered FAR smarter than either my mother-inlaw or my husband's aunt by any and all who knew them and he's about the same as my mother was overall in intellect (he is more incredible in the engineering and physics and inventing and creating hands on areas where she was more incredible in languages - both speaking and writing of several, leadership, loving, art, etc.).

My point is you will be admired or not far more for what you do once out of college than your high school or college GPA, rank, etc. Indeed, having high honors in high school or college can really make people wonder, "What happened?" as some of those I know really don't impress me much intellectually and I wonder if they just attended small, easy schools or took a dive in intellect like myself, but it would be too rude to ask.

By Geniusash (Geniusash) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 07:44 pm: Edit

HSimpson, I'm a girl w/1540 and only a 3.6 uw (which is like 120/600 in my class) I do understand what you mean about the girls who kiss teachers' a$$es. Think about the Valedictorians we get with unweighted grades!!

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 08:00 pm: Edit

Magenta, you seem to have inferred something that I never said. I have no problem with smart girls, in fact I would prefer dating a girl that is smarter than me (if I can find one). I will explain how finding out questions an hour, or even minutes, before a test can help. They each find out 5 questions from their friends. They meet in a group and determine the answers. Then they all get A's. Geniusash, I'm glad you can feel my pain...hehe. I mean, the teachers ask rhetorical questions, and these girls answer them! I say there is nothing wrong with working really hard to get a 4.0, which is why I can respect 2 or 3 of the top girls, but the rest are cheating kiss-ups. Geniusash, why such a low rank? I have about a 3.478uw(about...lol) and my rank is between 10 and 15 out of 190.

BTW, if I wanted to, I could easily accel in English. THe thing is, I'm lazy. I prefer mindless television to reading. Reading is how you get talent in writing. That's why my sentences sound wrong sometimes...hehe

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 09:46 pm: Edit

I see your point
but hey I think your English is great you got a 720!!! and thatís an amazing score!!!!!!
your over all sat score is just perfect! but when it comes to this about duke Ed you just have to show that you really are smarter and more well rounded than her!!
and Iím certain that you will come up with one heck of admissions essay!!!!!
good luck!!!!! donít give up
and donít worry about your class rank , yes life is unfair but Iím shure you can stand out you really are a bright kid that has gained his place with handwork!! show duke that!! use creative writing!!:) best of luck!!
Iím also considering Duke Univ. .for the fall of 2006 Hey who knows we might both get in hope to see you there!!

By Magenta (Magenta) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 10:02 pm: Edit

Hsimpson, yes, I might have thought you liked girls being dumb because you said you hated being proven wrong about them not being dumb. Was that as dumb of me as not catching the "wronge" typo (man, I must make a typo every other word and should take the time to proof my work, but I'm even lazier than you!).

I agree that reading is one thing (though not the only thing) that improves writing, which is also my excuse for being a lousy writer.

And Cornell(some number here), if you plan to go to Duke, what's the reason your handle is Cornell?
As a word of caution, if you marry someone smarter than you are, you could increase the odds (from what I can tell reading the research to date) of having offspring with all sorts of alphabet soup labels (OCD, ADHD, BPD, etc.), and autism, Tourettes and various other interesting stuff that seems more prevalent in families where both parents have high IQs. Maybe they will have found ways (genetic engineering or whatever) around all those by the time you have children, though this might actually not be good as many of the great contributions to society have been made by people with those sorts of labels. If you want a family planning tip (which you likely don't, but hey, here it is anyway), forget the financial savings of having December babies (my parents purposely shot for having both children in December for the full year write off with only having a kid for a few days...this is what happens when a physicist/engineer and statistician marry!) try to have summer babies to lessen the odds of schizophrenia (getting the flu in the 6th month of pregnancy, as many mothers of winter babies do, increases the odds of the offspring having schizophrenia). Oh, and my brother and I aren't schizophrenic...or maybe I am living in a fantasy world and just think that's the case. ;) A winter birth only increases the odds rather than always results in the condition, obviously.

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 10:26 pm: Edit

hahaha what are you talking about????? your talking about babies?? how is this related to anything said here??LOL

By Rubenizm (Rubenizm) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 10:34 pm: Edit

"Well, I saw the Valedictorian asking her friend what was on the test as soon as she got out of the classroom... "
Haha in my school you would be surprised NOT to see a stack of students asking the other class about the test. The teachers know and don't care.

You know now that i see how screwed you are h(and you are screwed), i realize how great it is that my school doesn't rank. I mean serisously, that's just great. All we have is WGPA, no percentiles nothing! My Gpa is a 4.5(to be changes to 4.6 due to error), and while there are like 10 people with higher GPA's noone will ever find out. Monty county whohooo!

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Wednesday, September 10, 2003 - 10:40 pm: Edit

rubenizm!!! glad ur back!! lol i just love your remarks lol!!ur so direct haha
where the heck have you been its been long since ive seen ya post!
hey rubenizm imagine if that girl would apply by RD and him by ED and lets say she gets in and he doesnt and she doesnt really go to duke!!and duke only accepted her from that hs since she was the valedictorian
i mean that would be real funny not to be mean ofcorse

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 09:17 am: Edit

...yeah, hilarious!!!

I don't want advice on babies!!!!! I'm in high school!!!

By Magenta (Magenta) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 10:03 am: Edit

Okay, okay, sorry for the digression into babies. My free associating mind gets me in trouble.

By Tsdad (Tsdad) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 01:41 pm: Edit

Sorry, I still don't understand what the problem is. Your credentials make you elegible to be admitted to any college in the country.

I'm sorry that someone is doing even better than you. Guess what? When you get to college, and then real life, you'll find lots of people who are smarter or more successful than you.

In the real world success most often goes to hard workers who can get along with people. Smart's nice, but not as important as hard work and being nice.

I suggest you start working on both right now.

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 02:54 pm: Edit

magenta LOL its allright i kinda have that problem too i just say whats on my mind then i realize its uh out of the subject lol
but hey it wouldnt be any fun if people were all da same :)

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 03:07 pm: Edit

Your words hurt, tsdad, but they are true... Except that I do work hard. I am just not willing to learn stuff that I think is dumb, and i'm not willing to cheat. You are right though about me being nicer. Perhaps that will come with maturity.

Magenta, you sure know how to scare a guy...

By Magenta (Magenta) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 05:22 pm: Edit

Cornell, thanks for cutting me some slack. I didn't even recall telling you my pant size. :)

Hsimpson, how did I scare you? Was it just bringing up the "b" word (as in babies)?

Anyway, I agree that hard work and being nice will get people farther in general than smarts alone, and that everyone in the world could be nicer (I don't care how kind a person is) and everyone could work harder no matter how hard they work (until they drop dead from exhaustion), so I can't say it's necessarily bad advice to tell someone to be nicer or work harder, but is it nice to tell someone only known online that they should start working harder and being nicer right now in the way that it was done? My reaction was "Ouch" to that closing line, and you seem rather mature to have handled it with such finesse.

By Tsdad (Tsdad) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 07:56 pm: Edit

Be happy. You are a success. You did good. Someone will always be better looking, smarter, or richer than you. So what.

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 08:04 pm: Edit

please check out mny post its called: CHECK THIS OUT!

By Cornell00 (Cornell00) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 08:04 pm: Edit

please check out my post its called: CHECK THIS OUT!

By Aspirer42 (Aspirer42) on Thursday, September 11, 2003 - 11:09 pm: Edit

Hey, *I* enjoyed the family-planning aside... :)
To HS or whoever asked: My stats are basically the same ones on http://www.collegeconfidential.com/discus/messages/757/13542.html - but be sure to read all my posts in the topic, including the one correcting the rather glaring SAT typo. Add another year onto most of those ECs and the fact I'm taking my SATIIs in Writing, MathIIc, and Literature and you have me as I virtually stand. (pun not indended)
I love Duke, but not enough to be applying for them ED, so don't worry- your application is safe from me. Or would it be the other way around?
And finally, our group of 'top students' seems to be organized much like the gender split of professional Scrabble: most of them are girls, but the ones at the very top (esp. me and the valedictorian) are chiefly male. Aforementioned incident aside, most of us are rather moral in our academics.

PS: Several of the colleges on that linked topic I'm not looking at any more, just so you know. I'm probably going to end up applying to Chicago (EA), Haverford, St. John's, Duke, Swarthmore, UNC (EA), Yale, and Tufts, with all but the last two in approximate order of preference.

By Geniusash (Geniusash) on Monday, September 15, 2003 - 08:53 pm: Edit

HSimpson, although this is late, I'll explain my rank. Because our grades are unweighted and many people take classes like band/choir/guitar/basic foods/contemporary lit (reading Stephen King)/Sociology/chemistry in the community, many people have very high GPAs, those courses aren't exactly tough.

By Rubenizm (Rubenizm) on Monday, September 15, 2003 - 10:40 pm: Edit

alright i think your question has been answered numerous times - you ARE screwed... to an extent.

By Jamimom (Jamimom) on Tuesday, September 16, 2003 - 11:28 am: Edit

I don't see the concern. In all of the schools that I've seen, there are multiple applications to many colleges. Harvard one year took 9 from a school where my son went--6 EA and 3 regular. And there were 6 who went to Northwestern from another school listing where their graduates were going. In Jay Mathews' book "Harvard, Schmarvard". he addresses a situation where in a small private school more than 20 students applied one year to Bowdoin. That was a problem. Some students probably did not get accepted that would have had so many not applied, or if they had gone to another school. Bowdoin took 6 of them and Bowdoin is a tiny college.
You'll make yourself go crazy trying to figure who is applying where and worrying about it. There is an urban/suburban legend about students stealing and hiding school copies of catalogues for colleges they want so no one else discovers them.
There is a book out by a former admissions officer at Duke that outlines that college's process of admissions. If you are taking top level classes and your recs and essay are excellent, you could possibly be a one read accept based on your SAT numbers. Your classmate is not. Also aunts and uncles are not legacies. Even if she were a legacy, those are usually examined in a pool among other legacies because no school wants to accept too many legacies and tries to keep the number in line based on the qualifications of the rest of the pool.For all you know, a neighboring school, (same geographics) could have dozens of Duke applicants that may be considered with your school. Usually a school comparision is done after the decisions are made to make sure there is not a gross discrepancy within a school, but the adjustment is usually a waitlist status for someone rejected. It is not a big deal thing. You are not screwed.

By Esmerelda (Esmerelda) on Saturday, September 20, 2003 - 07:41 pm: Edit

oh, okay, i'm kinda going back to that whole 'girls cheating' thing. it's not only girls. At our school, there was the whole elaborate cheating going on in AP World. I think me and two of my friends (all girls) were the only people out of it in our class. These jocky guys would take the test first period and compare their answers, making a cheat sheet to SELL to students in the latter classes! I had World 8th period, and had to sit in front of these guys who would pass the paper back and forth between them . The teacher either didn't know or didn't care. On the first test of the year, we had a substitute, who left the room for about 5 minutes during the test. The teacher was not very good, and didn't teach anything. So, the entire class started yelling the questions back and forth, coming to an concensus. It was awful. I just covered one of my ears with my left hand and tried not to hear. My best friend and I were one of the few people who didn't cheat. The next day as we got our scores back, the substitute was passing the tests out. IN DECREASING ORDER OF GRADES!! The idiots sitting in front of me got 100%'s because they knew the questions ahead of time and worked together. My friend and I got the lowest grades in the entire class. Although we both got A's in the end (we studied somewhere between 8 and 24 hours (on the weekends) per test--really!-- And did well on our research papers and essay tests), it was still really demoralizing knowing that those boys were getting the same grade for no work. I'm not saying that all boys cheat (although you seem to be wrongly suggesting that all girls cheat) because in my class almost everyone cheated. In fact, I can pretty much point out cheaters. A few of my friends think it's okay to mention questions on a test to other students, other are okay with copying homework. Personally, I don't do either. Our school is so competitive, some people fell that it is worth it to copy someone elses. Ridiculus.
okay, that's my piece. sorry, had to rant a bit.

By Hsimpson2k4 (Hsimpson2k4) on Saturday, September 20, 2003 - 07:54 pm: Edit

Thanks everyone. I am applying round two early decision to Emory, and I think I have a damn good shot there if Duke defers me.

Let's just say that all cheaters suck!I want to learn how to hack. I could make an anti-cheat, where I lower the grades of cheaters...hehehe.

The problem is the school would know my ip if I hacked in, so there isn't much point. Whenever cheaters ask me questions, I always tell them the wrong answers. Maybe that's why the boy cheaters get C's...lmao. I AM SO EVIL!

By Eileen (Eileen) on Sunday, September 28, 2003 - 01:09 am: Edit

Apply if you want to go. Do not let what others do hold you back.

A Professor


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