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Okay, so we're supposed to let them go and find their own way once we drop them off at the dorm. But... some students are prone to be risk takers, at least I believe they identified a gene recently that suggests this is an innate behavior.

What would you do if you found out, via an internet search, that your child was involved in risky, dangerous behavior? Would you confront the student with the proof? Take an indirect approach and talk around the problem?

I know most of you have perfect children, so I'm looking for advice from parents who have (successfully) weathered the storm of rebellion.

By Boysmom (Boysmom) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 05:16 pm: Edit

Nobody on this planet has perfect children. But let me address your actual question: that would depend on the risky behavior. Is this life threatening? Then I would definitely sit them down and discuss it. No beating around the bush. Or is this behavior something we wouldn't do but unlikely to cause death? Then I would let them know what I think about the subject, but there's little we can do to control adult children. Or is it just something that maybe they shouldn't be doing but more of a difference of opinion? Then I would trust that my great job of raising them combined with their eventual maturity will eventually take care of it.

By Cheers (Cheers) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 05:16 pm: Edit

Can you describe the behavior in more detail?

By April_Mom04 (April_Mom04) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 05:41 pm: Edit

Let's just say that student has mild learning disabilities in the area of math. And consequently, ended up in the special ed program at the high school. Most of the other students in this program ended up dropping out due to behavioral problems (drugs/alcohol/etc.).

But - student was motivated to succeed and is currently at a 4-year program at a college 1-hour from home (and received a beautiful scholarship, despite low SAT scores < 1000). However, because most of student's friends were in this high risk group, student continues to seek out their companionship. Since student is only 1-hour from home, these "friends" are still available whenever student feels insecure. Should I wait it out, or intervene? Roommates are absolutely awesome and perfect, so it's really the insecurities that are keeping the old friendships intact.

By Searchingavalon (Searchingavalon) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 06:23 pm: Edit

I could be misunderstanding, but it sounds to me that your child managed to avoid her high school friends' risky/dangerous behaviour from rubbing off on him/her before. Do you know for sure whether your child is "doing" anything risky now, or just still hanging out with old friends who do risky dangerous things? Are you sure it's insecurity, or could it be just a wish not to be disloyal to old friends? Either way, if it's just the "hanging out" which is troublesome, it could lessen over time. Unless child is in immediate real danger (and you'd be the best to decide that), I'd talk around it rather than confront it. From everthing I've read and heard, directly trying to keep kids away from their friends is hard and sometimes counterproductive.

By Backhandgrip (Backhandgrip) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 06:28 pm: Edit

Well, there are two ways to go.Confront the student and see if that goes anywhere or mildly suggest he make a change and see if appeals to common sense works.I knew a boy who got drunk and high with buddies and they played a game trying to jump on moving trains.Needless to say, he died on the operating room table after an accident.He was SO cute, just reckless.

What I would do. GO DIRECT AND FOR SHOCK. Tell your son how much you all love him.Talk about all the cute times he amused you as a child.Ask him what he remembers of his best times, also his earliest memories.Tell him this kind of new behavior is unacceptable.Tell him 'I've made some terrible mistakes in the past'. ie... putting him in special ed- I know this is not true, but it may help you. Oftentimes one has to eat crow to get what they want.Show him articles of other kids who have died tragically in accidents.Talk about other local incidents and how often you think of the horror and their families and the saddness in their eyes when they walk to their front door, and that child you knew.You cannot do this while smoking a cigarette or doing anything self- destructive.
Then tell him that the self destructive behavior must stop or you will not be there for him. Be blunt and to the point.This is what I would do- because I do not want to go to any more funerals of young beautiful people.
Then, and this is important, be proactive and discuss alternative things to do.Like, what do you really like Jimmy. Can you get a job on campus as an usher at the shows? Or, so you have spare time on your hands. How about taking a ceramics class? I'll pay for it. Or, most important call the club leader of some club and tell them Jimmy is coming, and maybe Jimmy can get involved with building houses for Habitate for Humanity or work in the college day care center.
I think you have to get involved because this is what son is used to from his schooldays and he may be receptive to it.

By Backhandgrip (Backhandgrip) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 06:38 pm: Edit

Then, if anything ever does happen, you are guilt free. You did as much as you could do. You will be able to sleep at night.

By Demingy (Demingy) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 07:05 pm: Edit

I don't mean any offense, but it sounds like you may be jumping the gun here. It sounds like your kid has already dealt with peer pressure and didn't get into trouble even though he/she was with these friends. I don't think that it should change now, especially since your child is in college now and not seeing these people daily (I'm assuming).

Also, as the "good girl" who has never done an illegal drug (yes, that includes pot for those people who seem to think that pot doesn't count) but still "hung out" with the "wrong crowd", I'd like to point out that talking to (and even being friends with) people who do drugs doesn't mean that you are involved in dangerous and risky behavior. I'm primarily pointing this out because it really does sound like these people didn't drag your child into what they did.

You are right to be watchful if you feel that there is a risk, but please don't jump to conclusions. If you say something to your kid now when there is no indication that he/she is involved in any real dangerous/risky behavior (drugs, heavy drinking, cutting, theft, etc) then he/she will know that you don't trust him/her. This could also lead to them pulling away from you and being less inclined to share too much---being afraid that if he/she admits to talking with someone you don't approve of you'll judge them again.

Again, I don't mean any offense, and this is based on what you've written which is rather non-specific.

By Cheers (Cheers) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 07:35 pm: Edit

I'll second Demiguy and urge you to trust your child (and the parenting you've put in) to work through the insecurities and learn to let go of the lesser peers. This might take time.

Honestly, try to reserve shock and awe for REAL, not potential, risky behavior. (Someone should have given GW the same advice....)

By Backhandgrip (Backhandgrip) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 08:02 pm: Edit

Cheers; read the first line, "what would you do if you found out via the internet your child was involved in risky, dangerous behavior?"
Intervene, because if you don't and something happens you will regret it.There is nothing wrong with being a concerned mom.

By Backhandgrip (Backhandgrip) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 08:05 pm: Edit

April Mom; don't feel you have to explain everything in detail to everyone on C.C.This place is no different than an office cafeteria.

By Robyrm (Robyrm) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 09:02 pm: Edit

Is your child someone who likes to take risks, a thrill seeker?? In addition to confronting concerns (in a general way, unless you have specific information about a specific event-- I think every parent of every college kid shold be proactive about this issue..) about "bad risk taking", you might find that your child can "get it out of their system" with some healthful risk taking behavior- sky diving, scuba, rock climbing, bungee jumping- you know, all those X game sports.

Some kids just need a ton of excitement in their lives, they are really insatiable for it, and if they don't get it in a healthful way, they find it in other ways....

By Cheers (Cheers) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 09:28 pm: Edit

But - student was motivated to succeed and is currently at a 4-year program at a college 1-hour from home (and received a beautiful scholarship, despite low SAT scores < 1000). However, because most of student's friends were in this high risk group, student continues to seek out their companionship. Since student is only 1-hour from home, these "friends" are still available whenever student feels insecure...Roommates are absolutely awesome and perfect, so it's really the insecurities that are keeping the old friendships intact.

Sorry Backhandgrip. I read the follow up post from April as potential (and worrisome) risky behavior, not actual risky behavior --with a shot of real hope too. That was the clarification I wanted.

To give my advice. My opinion. Take it how you will--but please--chill.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 09:55 pm: Edit

I think I'd take a wait and see approach myself. Sounds like you have an overall good kid who has pulled herself/himself above the fray before...give them a chance to do so again before you step in. And pray alot.

I know it is hard but sometimes you just have to let go and let them rise or fall to the occaision.

By Backhandgrip (Backhandgrip) on Saturday, October 02, 2004 - 08:17 am: Edit

Cheers; I just give what I've gotten on C.C.
Another concern is the low SAT.I would keep informed about what is going on academically and offer encouragement. A low SAT may indicate a few missteps along the line , like dropping a class here or there because it turns out too hard.(Like my eyes are bigger than my stomach.)Tht's not a problem. Just be encouraging, like, 'so Econ was too hard, take a withdrawal and try something you like instead!'

By Soozievt (Soozievt) on Saturday, October 02, 2004 - 08:42 am: Edit

I tend to agree with some others that as of now, your child is not engaging in risky behaviors. I realize you see the potential or chance of that happening but it has not necesarily occurred at this time. You mentioned that your child was able to succeed in high school and get into college despite friendship patterns with those who have taken a more "troubled" path. So, she obviously has been able to keep on her path and resist certain behaviors while being friends with these kids. I am not sure why that would change now. I understand your concern that there is potential there as she may be hanging with the wrong crowd so to speak but she has not had a problem to date. And now that she is on her own at college, she is going to have lots of temptations even among the college kids. It sounds to me like your daughter is one not to stoop to temptation as easily. I realize you prefer her to now be friends with these college kids, rather than the wrong crowd from HS. But there will be college kids too who are doing some not so good things, so it is more about your daughter's ability to stay on her path. It is not really just about these kids from her hometown. The college kids might look like a better crowd to you, but among the kids on campus, there will be kids also doing drugs and overdoing it with alcohol, so you can't shield her from such students. It sounds to me that she does not engage in risky behaviors by association, at least has not to date. She stayed the course. That is a good sign.

I gather you found some evidence that she is getting together with high school friends. Are they traveling to her school or vice versa? You could engage in some conversation about who she has been hanging with on the weekends and how this is a great time to be making new friends with the college kids. You can ask if she has seen any of the HS kids lately or been in touch, just as conversation. Even IF the HS kids were the best kids in the world who did not do risky things, you could get into a conversation about her trying to get going on her college social life/scene and not to rely on HS kids too much because it will keep her from really getting into the groove at her college. For any kid, it might be better to be e mailing and calling hometown friends but not skipping out on college activities and kids to go be with the high school ones as then the kid has not yet breaked away which will keep her from making efforts to get into the social scene at her new school. Because her college is so nearby, and the fact that she can see her old friends, is sort of a "clutch" and not a full attempt to make it in this new place. Maybe you can suggest things she can do on weekends at college, with her roomies or in new clubs and such. If she gets busy there, she will have less time to be with HS kids. College ideally is a new experience where the kid breaks away from the familiar at home. That could be more of a topic of discussion or encouragement rather than bemoaning to her about the "wrong crowd".

But I still do not think your D has engaged in what most of us would think of as risky behavior. Unless you have evidence that she is involved in drugs and such, then the only concern here is who her friends are. Up to this point, she has managed to do really well and not go down their chosen paths and stay the course. I don't see how you have any evidence that SHE has changed or taken any risky turns. She managed to be friends with those kids before so nothing new has changed. The only issue to me is that she needs to break from relying on home friends and starting to make a new social life on campus. That will take time. It will take longer if her social plans are with hometown friends. That certainly is a safe topic to discuss with your daughter without putting down the hometown crowd.

Susan

By Backhandgrip (Backhandgrip) on Saturday, October 02, 2004 - 09:30 am: Edit

The thing to remember on C.C. is there are no wrong answers. What you have are multiple opinions of multiple people who come from varied backgrounds and have varied experiences.ALL ANSWERS ARE GOOD BUT MAY NOT BE THE RIGHT ONE FOR YOU.
Whenever I see a red flag I choose to err on the side of caution.Red flags for me is your statement that 'child is involved in risky dangerous behavior' or say, 'shoot me now'.As there are kids I knew in my community who have died in accidents and committed suicide, I think taking a gentle concerned proactive approach with young people is the way to go.I know families in my community who would give anything for a second chance to deal with a certain situation which had a tragic outcome.
My comment about a low SAT comes from experience. Over 30 years ago my SAT was not the highest. It took mistakes to learn certain courses were just too hard for me.So I speak here from experience.

All responses are good, you have to choose the approach you take.I sincerely apologize if anyone who takes offense by any comment I make however, time and again an offhand comment is made and rather than an live and let live attitude on someone's point of view people are quick to say how wrong the other person's comment is.
When I came to C.C. I was put in a position to explain myself to young people on the parent's forum. Later, I felt that was not necessary. Anyone does not have to explain themselves if it is too personal or they feel uncomfortable and many peole here do so.It is appropriate to bring this up as who knows if you are new or an old timer.

By April_Mom04 (April_Mom04) on Saturday, October 02, 2004 - 02:52 pm: Edit

Thank you all for your insightful responses. You have all made good points, and hit the nail from different sides. But I think Backhandgrip's comment about doing nothing and sleeping at night got to me the most.

We will be meeting for dinner this evening, and I am going to approach the subject of the publicly posted information that disturbs me. I totally agree that too many people get sucked into posting too much personal information in public forums, and this is what she is getting caught up in with the HS friends. One of these HS "friends" even published my daughter's cell phone number online - and I had to contact the moderator to remove it. Thank goodness I caught this - but there is other damaging, personal information being posted too freely as well. I must nip this in the bud, even though I may appear to be a nosy mom. The comment about disloyalty rings true, as the HS friends do not want to leave go, and she feels she must respond to all contacts. As I write this, I am realizing that this one HS friend is probably posting the information as a means of controlling her.

BUT on the positive side, she reports that she LOVES college, has an audition tomorrow, and has a wonderful new boyfriend (who we really like). And yes, Backhand, we have had talks about grades and recognizing when things are out of control. She is totally immersed in classes she loves and teachers she adores and has been frequenting the writing center as needed. And Carolyn - I do pray a lot for this one especially.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Saturday, October 02, 2004 - 06:48 pm: Edit

April Mom, Hugs to you. I am surprised at what some kids will post on the internet, especially in live journal. I've had to talk to both of my kids about this - not for illegal stuff but very very personal stuff that they thought only their "friends" would see. It kind of sends chills down your spine to see such personal stuff exposed for anyone to see and read...and that's before you even start processing what they're actually DOING. I'll say a prayer for your daughter as well.

By Cheers (Cheers) on Saturday, October 02, 2004 - 07:19 pm: Edit

We will be meeting for dinner this evening, and I am going to approach the subject of the publicly posted information that disturbs me.

Sounds like a balanced, sure approach though you may have to explain how you 'came upon' the info. Maybe you can tell a CC story first--about how some parents post too much personal information and then give examples of the downsides.

The worst that child can say is "Mom, back-off, I can handle it." Which is probably true, judging past accomplishments.

It takes time to turn new friends into comfortable old friends. The new friends at college don't feel quite right--yet. It's easier to chat up old friends. That transition time soon passes.

By Dmd77 (Dmd77) on Monday, October 04, 2004 - 08:58 pm: Edit

Is the publicly posted information on Livejournal, perhaps? Or one of the other blogging sites? My daughter posts on Livejournal; I'm not supposed to read it, but I know it's there. A number of years ago, when I first found her posts, I did read them and was worried. I then discovered that many kids lie in their journals (I know, why bother?, but they do). Her journal, as it happened, was accurate, and was cause for concern. There was a minor medical issue, I confronted her--it's been solved. It was somewhat damaging to her trust in me--but we've worked it out. Sometimes you have to love them enough to let them hate you for a while.

By April_Mom04 (April_Mom04) on Monday, October 04, 2004 - 11:11 pm: Edit

I periodically do a web search for all family member's names and email addresses, after reading an article in the Wall Street Journal. This is how I found it.

When I showed her the printout of the information - she was SHOCKED to the very core of her being! It blew her away to know what was out there in writing, how easy it was to find, how easily identifiable she was and that it would live on the internet forever unless she deleted it.

Needless to say - it was a difficult conversation but I think in the future she will be more guarded in the information that she posts.

Although the trust issue did come up ("Why are you spying on me?" Answer: "If I can find this, so can anyone else.") I think deepdown she appreciates that we warned her about this. ("I can't believe I put that out there. That was really stupid.") I worried that she would hate us for awhile, but that would have been the lesser of two evils in this case. Thankfully, she is still talking to us and I think it was one of those maturing moments that will take a while to set in.

Thanks for all your concern, prayers and helpful comments.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Tuesday, October 05, 2004 - 12:24 pm: Edit

April Mom, I'm glad it sounds like it worked out for you. I wish your daughter well. She's lucky to have such a good mom. Carolyn

By Demingy (Demingy) on Tuesday, October 05, 2004 - 01:05 pm: Edit

April Mom- I'm also glad that things worked out for you. It sounds like you approached it well and your daughter is aware of what is going on and your concerns.

By Rhonda63 (Rhonda63) on Wednesday, October 06, 2004 - 02:59 pm: Edit

April Mom, I'm really glad it worked out well for you. Just so you know, I think we have all had moments of concern and fear for our kids, some more than others, even if we have not had the same exact experience. So you are most definitely not alone. Best of luck to your D, she sounds like a very promising young lady. The fact that you and she could have this conversation says a lot.