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Need some advice and a shoulder to cry on.

My half-brother has wanted to go to West Point since he was small.

Our parents, despite both having master's degrees and putting 4 older children through various stages of college, sort of spaced out on this whole application process.

Somehow, they were convinced that my brother would make it in. But the list of mistakes made during the application process goes on and on. (See below for more info on what went wrong if you're interested, and for his stats.)

Anyway, he was waitlisted last week. Which, at the service academies, I guess means pretty much "forget it".

Here's the BIG problem: he didn't apply anywhere else.

I know, I know. It's beyond comprehension. It's like they were all drinking the same "If you want it bad enough, it will happen" Kool-Aid.

One more thing: he's currently on his senior class trip right now, so he doesn't know any of this yet. He doesn't know he's been waitlisted.

But my parents are finally waking up and FREAKING OUT.

They have found a few schools online that are still accepting applications and that have ROTC programs, one of which is Clemson. They don't know anything about Clemson. They have not visited. They don't know how my brother will feel about it since he's gone.

Other schools they are considering at this point are Rutgers and Purdue, because they're still taking apps and they have ROTC programs. Again, my parents and brother know NOTHING about these schools other than what they read on the web sites.

My question is: are there any other schools that are still taking applications, that maybe have a ROTC program, that aren't too expensive (we're talking about 2 retirees putting a "late in life" 5th child through college after years of scrimping and saving for the private school they thought would increase his chances of getting into his dream school), and that have some level of decent academics or at least some name recognition.

What a total mess. I know it must sound like they are flaky and deserve this mess, but you'll have to trust me that I honestly think it was some sort of groupthink cult mentality that took over the family. It's like they lost their minds. I have no idea what they were thinking. Like I said, they're two master's degree parents who had already put 4 kids through competitive schools. I don't know what happened, but boy are they hurting now. I've never heard my mom so upset in my life.

They feel terrible that basically they are having to choose colleges and fill out applications in a blind panic FOR HIM while he's in Europe and he's going to get back next week and be blindsided by all this stuff. They feel like they let him down, and they feel a lot of guilt for how the whole situation was handled. It's like they're going through a wake-up process after being deprogrammed from a cult or something. It's really sad.

Thanks for reading if you got this far.

-megannnn

Monday Morning Quarterbacking
Or, More Details on What Went Wrong

(1) They didn't do their homework on what his #3 nomination ranking from the Senator meant. (i.e., a #3 nomination isn't as good as it sounds.) They didn't follow up with other Representatives to see if he had been nominated by them, or why not.

(2) They listened to all these well-meaning people telling him he was a "shoo-in" due to his stats and ECs, which turned out to be not as great as they thought. (sat:1390; valedictorian; 4.3 gpa; lots of ECs; music & sports; tons of leadership awards)

(3) They misread a lot of "standard" friendly marketing by the college as some sort of secret code for "we want you". Which, of course, is false.

(4) I asked him about his backup plan on my last trip up there and he said something about the West Point prep school being his backup plan. I didn't know what that was at the time, but it turns out that it is full up anyway, and it's not like you can just "apply" there. More misunderstandings.

(5) He applied early decision but due to the guidance office not getting his transcripts sent on time, his application was considered incomplete and he was deferred until regular decision.

By Buzzandjulie (Buzzandjulie) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 10:38 pm: Edit

I would think about Norwich university in vermont. My son went there and really enjoyed it. It is the oldest private military academy in US. Cadet run, many majors including engineering and I beleive they have rolling admissions the admissions director name in Macgrath I think My son actually thinks get a better education than the point for what he majored in can do rotc with full tuition and school picks up room and board

By Coureur (Coureur) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 10:42 pm: Edit

Gosh this is terrible. You have my complete sympathy. And you are on the right track with Rutgers. There was a parent on this board last year whose kid aimed too high and got turned down by all the colleges. They scrambled as your parents are doing and she ended up getting in and going to Rutgers.

Another strategy to consider: Take a gap year. If Rutgers or none of those other last-minute schools is a good fit, it might be best for your brother to take courses at the local community college, work and save up some money, then hit the application process hard for the class of 2009, casting a much wider net this time. Plus who knows? - maybe he could get into West Point on a second try.

By Hautbois (Hautbois) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 11:04 pm: Edit

After May 7 there is a site that will post schools that have openings. Check http://www.nacac.com/ and you'll see the brief information. Then wait until May 7th for postings.

There's also an article "What if I'm not accepted to college?": http://www.nacac.com/p&s_steps_0304planb.html

By Fredo (Fredo) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 11:05 pm: Edit

Definitely PUrdue over Clemson. My own D threw an app into Purdue just 2 weeks ago on a complete whim and heard within 10 days that she was in. She's in-state so that may make a difference. But it's an on-line app, strictly by the numbers, no essay (I think) so it would be easy for your parents to send it in. Purdue is a very solid school although I know nothing about their ROTC. Also, don't know what your brother wants to study. It costs $30 to apply but may very well be worth to have something. What about your own state school?

By Over30 (Over30) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 11:06 pm: Edit

Sorry about your brother.
My cousin's son is a sophomore at Univ. of Oklahoma, some kind of engineering/computer major, and is in Air Force ROTC. He's really happy there. He was rejected from the Air Force Academy. It's not the Point, it may not be an Ivy, but it's a good, solid school, with a lot of National Merit kids and a strong ROTC program. Their deadline is June 1. HTH

By Interesteddad (Interesteddad) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 11:12 pm: Edit

Rutgers, Purdue, and Clemson are all large public universities. US NEWS has them ranked in the same general range (#60 to 70 nationally). This puts them about on par with other second tier state universitis like the U of Georgia and Michigan State -- i.e. not UNC-Chapel Hill or UCLA, but better than U MASS. All three are plenty well respected and would offer a very solid education to a motivated student.

All three have strong regional characters. Clemson is VERY southern (see Clemson co-ed Cameron on this season's Real World). Purdue is VERY midwestern. You can get more "New Jersey" than Rutgers.

Your family should also be working your own state university hard, even going back to the Senator's office to pull some strings if necessary.

By Megannnn (Megannnn) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 11:14 pm: Edit

Thanks everyone, keep the suggestions coming.

I knew about the NACAC list, we are going to check that if this is still a problem on May 7 (fingers crossed). I looked at the results from last year to get an idea of what kinds of schools were on there. That's actually where I saw Rutgers, Purdue, and Clemson.

Fredo asked: "what about your own state school?" All deadlines have passed for our state schools, believe it or not. This is what is tearing us up the most because we have some fantastic state schools. But, alas.

I forwarded the info about Norwich and Purdue to my parents. I know they will flip out over the size of Purdue, but they need to get a grip: at this point, beggars can't be choosers.

-megannnn

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 11:17 pm: Edit

That is a horror story. Good luck to you brother, as well as your poor parents. I checked under service academies in this forum. There wasn't much info there, but I found this:

" There are forums for perspective students and parents that are listed on the USMA website. They are moderated by USMA parents and grads."

Try to find what the poster was talking about on the USMA website. Maybe you could get ideas there, as well as some idea of how hopeless the waitlist might be.

If he wants West Point and nothing else, a gap year isn't a bad idea. Is there another military prep school he could consider?

I would also call the state schools. Even though the deadlines have passed, if your brother would be high in their applicant pool they might make an exception.

By Soozievt (Soozievt) on Saturday, March 27, 2004 - 11:37 pm: Edit

I feel badly about this situation and I admire you for trying to help out. I do not really understand how this private high school they sent him to did not advise applying to more than one school, particularly when it is West Point. Too late for that though, just commenting.

I also think your family should look into Norwich University in Vermont. It is the oldest private military college, very well respected. If your brother is into engineering, they have it. Civilians can also attend this college. Our salutatorian is going there next year in fact as a civilian. It is a small school, nothing like Clemson, Rutgers, or Purdue. Please look into it if your brother was hoping for a military experience at a very fine institution. I live in Vermont by the way and have seen Norwich University many times.

Susan

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 12:16 am: Edit

>"I do not really understand how this private high school they sent him to did not advise applying to more than one school,"

This is a good point. One could view your brother's school as having more than a little responsibility here. And it might be more effective if his guidance counselor, rather than your parents, tried to pull some strings to get him in somewhere appropriate. It isn't a very good advertisement for their school if their valedictorian is left scrambling for a berth.

By Cheers (Cheers) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 12:31 am: Edit

Sometimes actions speak louder than words? Maybe there was a part of your brother that didn't want to go to West Point...next year at least. After all, he spent a year surrounded by peers who applied to more than one school. I am sure his peers told him he was dreaming.

Your parents shouldn't shoulder ALL the blame. He's a big boy, I assume.

A GAP year would be a good option. Heaps of UK and Australian kids do gap years. Check out gapyear.com.

By Calmom (Calmom) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 05:19 am: Edit

Megannn,
I am sorry that you are so stressed out and your parents are so upset.

But I would suggest that you stop worrying and let your brother handle things on his own when he gets back.

Prospective West Point cadets generally have the ability to deal with a little bit of adversity in their lives. I think your brother will be fine. Disappointed, of course... but I doubt that he is going to be in all that much of a panic when he gets back.

I mean, he's not stupid. I'm sure he knew that it's pretty tough to get into West Point.

Maybe the reason he didn't apply to any other colleges is that he isn't particularly enthused about college or interested in academics right now. Maybe his backup plan has simply been that if he didn't make it to West Point, he'd simply enlist. In fact, for all you know he may have already met with a military recruiter and have a very good idea of what he wants to with his life.

Anyway, I think you should wait until your brother gets back. I'm surprised that your parents opened the letter while he was gone. Part of the reason that everyone in the family is going nuts is that you don't have your brother around to be the voice of reason right now.

By Musicmom (Musicmom) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 07:09 am: Edit

Rutgers is a fine LARGE state U.
Many of our instate NJ applicants are not accepted as it does accept many out of staters.
Our S is accepted; it is his financial safety.
Fine education for the $$$$ but I'm told it can be impersonal since so large.
Best of luck.

By Aparent4 (Aparent4) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 07:54 am: Edit

How do you know waitlisting means forget it? Can your brother enlist the help of the Senator and the Representatives to hound them about filling a waitlist spot? Are #1 and #2 in your state going? Can he fill a spot from someone out of your state?

These are questions your brother should deal with when he gets home, in addition to filing the other apps.

What's puzzling me is that anyone being considered for West Point is very bright, and yet your brother chose not to apply anywhere else. Something doesn't add up here. Maybe, as Calmom says, there's more to this situation than we're seeing at first blush.

By Garland (Garland) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 09:35 am: Edit

I'd hesitate to do any long distance psychologizing, myself. We really don't know what the family dynamics are. I also see nothing wrong with Megannn helping out by doing research right now--since her brohter is not in a position to do so. Obviously, it's his call, and he'll have to make some tough decsions, but time is critical here, and the more information he has, the more he can pursue a good outcome in the amount of time left.

I don't think it matters whose fault it is, GC, parents, brother. I think that all of them will need to work together to help remedy this, and I think that Megann is a really admirable young woman for wanting to do what she can.

I'll just add that the only school you mentioned that I know about is Rutgers, whose academics are probably better than the rankings show, so it's worth looking at.

Best wishes to you and your family, Meg!

By Megannnn (Megannnn) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 09:48 am: Edit

Some additional details. I hesitated on posting this at first because this is a public forum and I was trying to be as objective as possible and not get into he-said-she-said and family dirty laundry since I'm sort of a peripheral party to this whole debacle in the first place. (Man, I hope my mom isn't reading this.)

My brother did have a few 2nd choice schools picked out. However, when he was filling out the applications he was talking to my mom about what he should write in his essay for "why I want to go to this school" and how anything he wrote would be a lie, since he really didn't want to go there. But instead of using this as a "teachable moment" to discuss contingency planning or something like that, she sort of said, "ok, don't apply then if you wouldn't be happy there, I don't want you to lie". I believe she fell into this thinking that he was a "shoo-in" for West Point because she believed some of the marketing they were getting from the school was favorable to him (like a "wink, wink, you're in"), when in fact it was standard fare.

My brother also told me earlier this month that one of my parents discouraged him from applying elsewhere since the fees were $50, and he didn't want to go there anyway. (I have doubts that this was a serious reason for not applying, since I applied to all my grad schools with application fee waivers, so they know about this option.)

Also, I think that maybe he was looking for a reason to "suicide" this school, thinking (as many naive applicants probably do) that his "valiant" effort would make him a stronger candidate and get him hero points ("Look, he didn't even apply anywhere else! This boy must really want to go here! What commitment! What faith!") and by NOT explicitly encouraging him to apply elsewhere, my parents tacitly validated his unwise plan.

Of course, what they didn't consider is that (a) no one knows where else you applied (b) not doing contingency planning is stupid and a college doesn't want people who would show such bad judgment (c) you're not "in" until the piece of paper is in your hand.

As for the guidance counselor, I have no idea what is up with that. But I'll let you know when I find out.

-megannnn

By Unmatchedsocks (Unmatchedsocks) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 10:02 am: Edit

Here is a list of schools with rolling admissions. I don't know if they are still accepting applications (Most of them has some type of final deadline), but I would imagine some of them are.

http://www.princetonreview.com/college/apply/articles/types/rollingcoll.asp

By Interesteddad (Interesteddad) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 10:24 am: Edit

>> My brother did have a few 2nd choice schools picked out. However, when he was filling out the applications he was talking to my mom about what he should write in his essay for "why I want to go to this school" and how anything he wrote would be a lie, since he really didn't want to go there.

I think you are making a mistake by "enabling" your brother by cleaning up his mess for him. It was his decision to not bother with the other applications and it really should be up to him to solve the problem.

Lord knows, he wouldn't have been the first student who had to write "Why Podunk U." essays for backup schools.

By Path1 (Path1) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 10:35 am: Edit

A friend's son was rejected from USNA a few years ago, went to the U of AZ for a while and did well there. He ended up dropping out of the U of AZ and enlisting in the Navy and from there received a "line nomination" to the academy. This was in a pre Iraq world though. I suggest your brother do whatever he wants (go to school, gap year) and be a lot more careful in the application process next year if he still wants West Point.

By Megannnn (Megannnn) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 10:51 am: Edit

Believe me, I am not enabling him! I think he's spoiled rotten as the youngest child and should just go to pudunk U and learn a lesson.

As I stated in my OP, the thread was for soliciting opinions of whether Podunk U or East Somewheresville U were still taking applications, and whether one was better than the other.

(Sorry for the sarcasm, I don't really think these schools that have been mentioned so far are bad, I'm just sick over the whole thing, and I was trying to give more psychological information to those who asked. I am definitely not on the side of enabling.)

-megannnn

By Ellemenope (Ellemenope) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 10:52 am: Edit

I know of someone who spent one year at a university and then applied to West Point. Of course, he had to go in as a freshman so his 1st year at the university was "wasted." Your brother should attend college next year--and if he still wants to go to West Point, he should start the application process again in the fall.

In the meantime, he can attend college and if he decides that WP isn't for him, he can just continue at the college he's at or transfer to another.

Purdue sounds great--especially if he is interested in engineering. I've heard that they have a good program.

Good luck to him.

By Marite (Marite) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 10:53 am: Edit

Megannn:

I read somewhere that the origins of the word snafu was in the military. They know about snafus. A good military strategist always has contingency planning.

I admire your willingness to help your brother all you can. But I'm with Interesteddad here. In refusing to consider alternatives to West Point, your brother showed a certain lack of maturity. A gap year might not be a bad idea. He'd learn that we don't always get the dream job, the dream house, the dream car and that we have to consider alternatives since we still have to earn a living, get a roof over our head and get some means of transport. Meanwhile, he could improve his profile and re-apply for next year. West Point is even more selective than the Ivies. This means that a SAT score of 1390 is not particularly impressive. But even if he does improve, he should make sure to apply to more than one place.

By Choff (Choff) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 11:08 am: Edit

Purdue does have rolling admissions, BUT certain programs/schools there close their admissions when full, with engineering being at the top of that list. Check their website. If I remember right, there will be information about which schools there are closed for admissions. What I'm saying is he may still be able to get in, but I have my doubts about the school of engineering at this date. Good luck!

By Txtaximom (Txtaximom) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 11:20 am: Edit

We have a family friend that was rejected from the Naval Academy,so he went NROTC at Tulane for a year, reapplied the next and got in. I think the idea of doing a year in an alternative that takes rolling admits and reapplying is a valid one. Good luck!

By Leadfooter (Leadfooter) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 11:33 am: Edit

Megannnn:

I have to respectfully disagree with the posters who think that you are enabling his immaturity. Of course, he may be immature. However, I don't think some people understand the very powerful influence that a well-intentioned GC, friend or parent can exert by insisting that X child will definitely get into X school. Many on this board take for granted the wonderful advice they receive from their schools, friends, CC or perhaps they are just much farther along in the research/learning process. We almost fell victim to the same over-confidence brought on by very well-intentioned people that we assumed knew their stuff. Fortunately, I was able to take the time to properly research and learn about the incredible selectivity of most of the schools our child applied to. Anyway, it's very hard to argue with a child who's being told that they will get into any school they apply to, especially by "authority" figures. I think it's wonderful that your family is pulling together to support your brother in this disappointing situation. My vote would be for Purdue, as it is a wonderful engineering school and has a great reputation with the military and NASA - I know he's thinking West Point, but who knows? By the way, I definitely think that after a brief mourning period, your brother needs to pull himself up by his bootstraps and assume responsibility for the entire process from here out. Maybe next year, he can write his essay about how he handled this rejection with integrity, honesty and resilience! Best of Luck to you and your brother!

By Leadfooter (Leadfooter) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 11:38 am: Edit

By the way, Choff is probably right about the Purdue engineering program being closed. However, I would still suggest calling and/or meeting in person with the appropriate personnel and asking for consideration. Exceptions can always be made if someone is personally impressed with your brother. Meanwhile, if he doesn't get in, have him study for the SAT and re-take it and keep in touch with those important people.

By Iflyjets (Iflyjets) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 11:52 am: Edit

Megann,

Each ROTC detachment at a college/university is commanded by an active duty officer who can nominate/recommend one (perhaps even more, that may vary by service and year) cadet in his/her cadet corps for the service academy that detachment represents (i.e, an AFROTC detachment would nominate for the AF Academy, and so forth). Txtaximom noted that someone she knew went to ROTC for a year and then went to an academy. I would suggest that this was possibly an example of this. Clearly, only the very best cadets are nominated, so your half-brother will have to be absolutely outstanding in his corps to even stand a chance of recommendation, and he will have to let the detachment commander know sometime after his first few months (I wouldn't walk right in and annouce my intentions until after I had demonstrated my military aptitude or left some type of very positive impression). Note also that some university detachments have better clout than others (that is, even among the ROTC detyachments, there is a pecking/ranking order...yes, that's honest). Norwich, Texas A&M, VMI, larger state schools (Ohio State, for example), will all have great ROTC corps. You can even ask how many cadets have ever transferred to the service academy (perhaps someone other than your sibling could tactfully ask this). Make sure that they have the service of ROTC he is interested in (i.e., Army versus Navy).


That being said, ROTC is also a great way to earn a commission in the Army. For some services, and depending on the needs of the service, the academies will get more of the "desirable" positions (I think especially of pilot slots for AF cadets a few years back, where AFROTC was well below the academy in numer of graduates going to pilot training)., but this will vary by the year and needs of the service. I believe the Army is pretty equitable about it's assignments after graduation. Wish your half-brother good luck in making his decisions from someone who went the ROTC route.

Marite, you are right: snafu is a military acronym, I believe stemming from late WW II. I won't write what it all stands for, but the f and u at the end are pretty self-explanatory!

By Jamimom (Jamimom) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 01:10 pm: Edit

Megannnn, your brother needs to survey his options and decide what to do at this point. He seems to be aware of what some of them are regarding some prepschools for the military academy where he could get into USMA next year if he does a postgraduate year at one of those schools. He needs to check if any will accept him at this late date. Being third choice is pretty high up there so he may still get into USMA, but there is no way he can count on it and it is late so he needs to go to Plan B.

The state universities that still have spaces are another alternative with or without ROTC scholarships as are military schools such as Norwich Universtiy.

Good luck to him. I am sorry that things turned out that way and he is lucky to have a sister who is concerned about his options and are seeking some solutions to the problem awaiting him.

By Gumbino (Gumbino) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 01:18 pm: Edit

Megannnn, very sorry at your brother's plight.

I would not advise you to consider Rutgers. I live in NJ. Somehow, outside of NJ, people have got the idea Rutgers is a good school. It isn't! The surrounding neighborhood is dangerous, too.

Somewhere on this forum I think I saw a thread listing schools with rolling admissions, or with late application deadlines. If I can find it I'll post a link here.

By Gumbino (Gumbino) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 01:23 pm: Edit

Oh, one other thing, Megannn: Some schools will consider applicants who will matriculate next spring, rather than this fall. (Some of their students will drop out or transfer, and they want to fill those empty spaces).

You might suggest to your brother that he do research on schools he might like, then call their admissions offices to see if they'll consider him for next spring.

By Disparat (Disparat) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 01:31 pm: Edit

You're brother's academics seem right on to me. Mine were pretty much exactly the same as his, and I got into West Point about November. Perhaps your state is really competitive in that respect? Lots of people going for nominations and such. I live in Delaware, so I don't think it's as big of a deal for me. Also, requirements aside from academics? Was he medically or physically disqualified? What I'm saying is that if he was qualified in all three areas, he has a really good chance of getting in...perhaps 75%.

Sometimes I wish admissions decisions were transferrable. I would give you mine. Some people definitely deserve it more than others...

By Megannnn (Megannnn) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 02:06 pm: Edit

Disparat, yes we are in an extremely competitive state. It's Virginia. (Proximity to DC, military bases all over the place.) This is another reason why this is so tragic - if the kid had just applied to UVA or W&M, then he could have tried for there as "in state" and ROTC and this case would be closed. Argh.

I just got off the phone with my parents and they are doing more planning and trying to hold it together. It's my dad who is upset today. Their plan is to give my brother a list of choices for what to do when he gets home and hopefully he will be able to think clearly enough that they can start to work through the choices.

Tomorrow they are planning to call around to "rolling" schools, and more competitive schools who have an unpopular ROTC program and see if they would consider him.

I prepped my mom with a way to sell her story so she (and my bro) wouldn't come off as a total idiot, but where she wasn't blaming anyone else either. Basically she's going to just say that he was "waitlisted everywhere", which is true.

I found out the guidance counselor situation at his school - it's a part time counselor who is not in touch with what is going on at the schools, is not clued in to the trends and what is realistic, etc. She is not returning next year. Most of the parents have had to do the work on their own and are disgusted with her.

I also found out that some of the other "authority figures" who were telling him he was a shoo-in included his Principal, and his West Point "mentor" (a retired Colonel and former WP prof from the area who has apparently bent over backwards to help, now that it has become apparent that my brother was not the shoo-in they thought). The mentor has been over to the house several times this week trying to help my parents figure out what to do.

Thanks for all your great suggestions and encouragement. Keep them coming, and I'll keep you posted. (This is a great board by the way.)

-megan

By Mike (Mike) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 03:23 pm: Edit

advice was bad. military acadamies are very selective. they are harder to predict too because the don't rely on stats as mucb as many other schools. the schools remainingthat hav e been mentioned are very good and ROTC has become a good way into the military these days. good to se big sister helping out. mike ignored teacher and mentos who kept telling him he was in and it turned out they were right but if still glad he applied ata lotbecausr the acceptences and scholarship offers were good for his ego


mike's dad

By Cheers (Cheers) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 03:44 pm: Edit

Of course your brother is immature. He's a seventeen year old boy. Goes with the territory! The business about telling mom he didn't want to "lie" on the other applications, that sounds like boyspeak too--for "I really don't feel like filling these out. Can you help me make the wrong decision?" Familiar stuff for clever boys.

And since he mentioned it to you, I think he did assess the possibility of failure. He decided to risk it anyway. I think he will land on his feet and I hope he appreciates how much his family did to find him alternatives.

By Mimk6 (Mimk6) on Sunday, March 28, 2004 - 06:13 pm: Edit

hi,

I just want to add that my best friend's son is at Clemson and is very happy.

Miriam

By Valpal (Valpal) on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 12:29 am: Edit

Megannnn, what a shame. I'm so sorry to hear that this happened. My sympathies are with both, your brother and your parents. But your brother a great student who surly has lots of options left to him. Lots of very good rolling admissions schools are still taking applications. He could enroll in one of these for a year and then, re-apply to The Academy. Who knows, he might even like his civilian college experience so well, that he changes his mind about pursuing the military career track. If he decides to take a gap year, he can get some work experience (and perhaps save a few dollars) under his belt, and do the whole college application process over again (this time, applying to several schools, of course).

I don't believe ROTC at civilian college is an option for this upcoming academic year, as the deadline to have filed a completed application was somewhere around January 15th (if memory serves me correctly). Most, if not all of this year's ROTC scholarships have already been awarded.

In any case, good luck to your little brother. I'm sure he'll bounce back from this rough patch. He's lucky to have a sister like you.

By Hill (Hill) on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 12:40 am: Edit

If you're in Virginia, try calling admissions at Virginia Tech. Can't hurt.

By Momof1 (Momof1) on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 01:49 am: Edit

Megannnn,

Don't mean to be a Pollyanna, but there are people sitting on declines for West Point. If he is waitlisted, perhaps you could find out where he stands on the waitlist, since students are appointed right up to the last few days before Reception Day. I know my son hasn't sent his declination in yet, yet he knows he will be going USNA.

I believe, as someone else posted, that the ROTC deadlines have all passed. The advice to go to a local college is good, as I know many cadets who have one or two years under their belts before being accepted.

Just remember, things always happen for a reason. Sometimes circumstances which seem disastrous are all for the best. That said, I still wouldn't want to be in your parents shoes. They must feel horrible.

Take care and keep us posted.

By Spearhead (Spearhead) on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 06:21 pm: Edit

My friend was waitlisted at Westpoint a month ago and on Saturday received his acceptance. Let Westpoint know they are still his #1 choice and would definitely go there if admitted. Talk to his Blue and Gold and ask if he has any info or what he can do to enhance his application to show he is the type they want there. How was his PAE and medical?

By Sauronone (Sauronone) on Monday, March 29, 2004 - 08:27 pm: Edit

I don't understand. Where was your brother while deciding on which colleges to apply to? How could HE let this happen? My parents did nothing for my college applications -- it took a bit of common sense for me to realize that I had to apply to at least three or four universites, of which one I could most definitely get in.

I guess what I'm saying is your brother should shoulder some, if not most, of the blame.

By Buzzandjulie (Buzzandjulie) on Wednesday, March 31, 2004 - 07:54 am: Edit

Please let us know what your brother fnally decides on

By Megannnn (Megannnn) on Wednesday, March 31, 2004 - 10:23 am: Edit

Thanks again to those of you who posted encouraging news and tips/helps for things to try at this stage. For those who are still attempting to "help us" figure out who to blame, thanks anyway...we know there's enough blame to go around until the sun goes supernova.

My brother got back last night from Europe and my parents broke the news. He is in denial right now. He's pretty much just shell-shocked. I'm sure he will have to go through the stages of grief, just like we did last week.

The good news is after about a million phone calls and various arm-twisting activities last week and this week, my parents found some "issues" in the way the nominations were distributed in their district (i.e. why they never heard back from their Representative and had to go with a #3 nom from a Senator). This is being investigated. I can't really be more specific than that, and I'm not sure it will help get him in at this point, but maybe the system can be fixed for the next kid who applies.

In addition, they are making some headway with ROTC programs for the schools that are still open (Clemson, Purdue).

And, last but not least, they spoke with the Dean of Admissions at an up-and-coming LAC in a nearby state who said that she would be happy to take my brother and he would absolutely NOT be a "college orphan" next year. In his shell-shocked state he seemed to be amenable to this suggestion last night. He has visited this college and liked it. It has a ROTC program, though they are not the "host" school for the program.

So we have a few things to pursue. My parents are waiting for him to "snap out of it" today and then they'll help him figure out which other directions he wants to pursue first, and which things he doesn't want to do (i.e. I don't think he'll want to go "enlist" at this point).

I'll keep you posted.

-megannnn

By Megannnn (Megannnn) on Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 02:15 pm: Edit

UPDATE!!

Good news. Turns out that my brother received a letter today with his offer of admissions to West Point.

My mom made about a million phone calls to the various congressmen and reps (one of which screwed up the nomination process and whereas my brother should have been first on their list, they didn't submit any names at all because they saw he was already on another senator's list, thus forcing him to be "only" 3rd on the other Senators list, which wasn't high enough to qualify). They apologized and re-submitted his name as their 1st choice, and this made a huge difference.

That action, combined with my brother meeting with a lot of people in ROTC (trying to find schools that would still take him) and high-ups in various WP leadership positions... and really impressing them with his attitude and general qualifications... resulted in him getting extended one of the "impossible to get" waiting list spots.

So, alls well that ends well, and the whole family has learned a valuable lesson about what happens when you don't make contingency plans.

Thanks to this board for the very valuable advice and good wishes.

Best of luck to everyone in their search for a "perfect fit" college.

-megannnn