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Are there any National AP Scholars here? I just saw the definition of that on college board and thought that must be an amazing feat. So, has anyone actually recieved this here?

National AP Scholar-
Granted to students in the United States who receive an average grade of at least 4 on all AP Exams taken, and grades of 4 or higher on eight or more of these exams on full-year courses (or the equivalent).

By Giants (Giants) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 01:18 am: Edit

i will have just on the nose

By Aspirer42 (Aspirer42) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 11:02 am: Edit

I probably will be by the time I graduate. (Gee, what a big help that'll be *then*...)

By Jason817 (Jason817) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 11:03 am: Edit

It only matters up to Junior year right? That sucks because I can get it after Senior year

By Txdad (Txdad) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 03:36 pm: Edit

Just received son's AP report: three 4's and six 5's. Adding two more 5's taken in sophomore year, he should be qualified for AP National Scholar as a rising senior. We are in Texas.

By Speeddemon608 (Speeddemon608) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 04:55 pm: Edit

9 ap tests?? hows that possible to take in one year? i might be misreading that, but if he did pull that off congrats to him

By Soulofheaven8 (Soulofheaven8) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 04:57 pm: Edit

I'm pretty sure there was a student who graduated two years ago from my school who got this award. Took as many APs as possible and got mostly 5s on all; he's currently matriculated at Cornell.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 05:09 pm: Edit

Speed,

Son took 6 full-year, 2 half-year AP classes during the school year. He also took the Physics C (Mechanics) test without taking class. As for AP National Scholar, there were 79 juniors received this award in 2002.

http://apcentral.collegeboard.com/repository/ap02_scholars_state_g_19134.xls

By Tanman (Tanman) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 06:24 pm: Edit

Txdad - just curious as to what classes your son took? Thanks

By Almostdone (Almostdone) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 06:32 pm: Edit

whoa Txdad ur son is amazing...esp the PHYSICS C SELF STUDY? and he got a 4 or 5? heard that was one of the HARDEST subjects...i myself took physics B and that was the hardest course i ever took. tell ur son congrats for me!

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 06:53 pm: Edit

"As for AP National Scholar, there were 79 juniors received this award in 2002."

Does mean that 79 juniors had the requisite number of APs after their sophomore APs and they got the certificate as fall juniors, or after their junior APs?

By Smiley (Smiley) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 07:16 pm: Edit

Interesting... surprised there aren't more scholar with distinction junior year (example: none from ME)... seems lots of kids would have 5 test in fresh/soph/junior years

By Txdad (Txdad) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 09:27 pm: Edit

Tanman, Son's junior schedule is as the following:
AP English Language
AP Art History
AP US History
AP Physics B
AP Chemistry
AP Macroeconomics, Government & Politics
AP Computer Science II
PreAP French

Calculus III at local CC

By Magicdragonfly (Magicdragonfly) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 09:47 pm: Edit

our school doesn't let you take APs in 9th grade, 10th grade you can only take 1 or 2(and as for 2- i don't know of anybody who is a sophomore that has been allowed to take 2..just think they'd let them in special cases..my class was the first that was allowed to take an AP in 10th grade)..and in 11th and 12th as many as you want

By Frick (Frick) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 10:42 pm: Edit

umm... physics c self studying is freaking easy... i started learning e&m about 48 hours before test time and still pulled a 4, and i never took physB

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 11:19 pm: Edit

Smiley - I'm not completely sure, but the way I'm reading it, if you are an AP scholar with distinction your junior year, that's a designation they send you in the fall of your junior year, so it would only be based on exams taken in May of frosh & soph years. The AP report my son received a few days ago only reflects his scholar designation at the end of the 2002 testing. It does not reflect the tests he just took in 2003.

It looks like if you don't take any AP exams until senior year, even if you get 5s on all 34 of them you don't get any awards. Txdad, is that what you think also?

By Mrsanguine101 (Mrsanguine101) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 11:25 pm: Edit

Right, it only matters for courses up to and including the end of one's junior year. If you take them as a senior, obviously you would not have your grades by college apps.

By Mrsanguine101 (Mrsanguine101) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 11:28 pm: Edit

If you have qualified by the end of your junior year, I beleive you will receive the award fall of senior year.

By Number9 (Number9) on Monday, July 21, 2003 - 11:29 pm: Edit

so it only counts upto Junior year? That sucks. I was aiming for something a little lower, but now I dont know if I can reach it...

AP US Hist
AP Psych
AP Euro Hist
AP Bio

Junior year...if I get 4s and 5s on all of those, what will I be able to qualify? Thinking about adding either AP World Hist (since US and Euro are being taken anyway) or AP French to that list...

Damn school, I can take only take 2 APs this year, already doing 2 self-study. And only 2 will be available next year. We only have 4 AP classes

By Txdad (Txdad) on Tuesday, July 22, 2003 - 08:17 am: Edit

Texas,

I believe Mrsanquine was right. According to collegeboard, "If you are an AP Scholar Award recipient, you and your school will be notified in the fall after the May administration. After that time, grade transcripts that you request to be sent to colleges will include the scholar designation." It means only the tests taken in or before the junior year would show up in your report for college application.

On the other hand, AP grades are not that significant for college admission. Most of the application would only have three slots for AP's anyway; and adcom's realize that in many areas, sophomores were not allowed to take AP courses. More important is the college credits AP would be able to qualify. It would be well worth the $50 test fee.

By Candad (Candad) on Tuesday, July 22, 2003 - 10:52 am: Edit

Last Sep. D recevied both National AP Scholar and AP Scholar with Distinction. She won't get this year's award before leaving for college. D scored five 5's in US Hist, Chem, Calc BC, Econ Micro & Macro, and 4 in Phys B (self study) last year. She also had two 5's and one 4 from Comp Sci AB, Euro Hist, French in Sophomore.

Txdad: Thanks for your info. I never knew D is that good.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Tuesday, July 22, 2003 - 11:38 am: Edit

Candad,

You are certainly welcome and congratulations for your D's achievements. What is your opinion about how much those AP awards affected her college acceptance?

Thanks,

By Elgreco (Elgreco) on Tuesday, July 22, 2003 - 01:00 pm: Edit

How many people got the AP Scholar with Honor award?

By Txdad (Txdad) on Tuesday, July 22, 2003 - 01:39 pm: Edit

AP Scholar with Honor 2002 - Summary
Grade | # of Winners
9 | 1
10 | 68
11 | 6,477
12 | 22,412
Not Stated | 433
Other | 262
College | 7
Total | 29,584

By Candad (Candad) on Tuesday, July 22, 2003 - 03:16 pm: Edit

Txdad,

College application is still mysterious to D and me. We cannot tell which criteria (academic records, standard test, EC, Essay, etc.) plays most important role in D's application. AP award alone may be a sufficient condition but not a necessary condition to going into top tiered school. On the other hand putting AP award in student's profile is MUCH better than not. A friend of D passed us a brochure that honors top 5% students of class 2002 in their school district (two HS, each has 700+ student in their classes). The Valedictorian (AP with distinction) of one HS turned down full rides from Duke and Johns Hopkins, went to MIT. The salutatorian (AP scholar with honar) from the same HS went to Stanford. The salutatorian (AP with distinction) from another HS got her EA deferred by Harvard, no matter her achivements like Siemens Westinghouse Sci. & Tech Finalist, Nat'l Siemens AP award. She was finally accepted by Harvard probably due to her Intel Sci. Talent Search scholarship.

AP award might play an important role in D's case (you can search her status under candad). Her school is NO NAME to most students/parants who traced top tiered HS in Illinois. In previous 3 graduated classes, nobody from her HS had been accepted by HYPSM. We couldn't imagine if she can still achieve it w/o AP awards.

Best wishes to your son.

By Planodad (Planodad) on Wednesday, July 23, 2003 - 12:21 pm: Edit

TxDad,
While 79 juniors were National Scholars in 2002, I believe that reflects the "old" rules where you only needed scores from 5 full-year AP exams, not 8 as you presently do.
The AP National Scholar award criteria was made harder this spring, spring of 2003.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Wednesday, July 23, 2003 - 12:55 pm: Edit

Thanks for the information. I was not aware that they raised the bar on National AP Scholar this year. The only thing I knew is that 5 full-year credits qualify Canadian students for this award. It would be interesting to see the number for 2003.

One correction: only 71 juniors were awarded National AP Scholar in 2002, not 79 as I originally posted.

By Mattman (Mattman) on Wednesday, July 23, 2003 - 01:01 pm: Edit

If Scholar is 3, w/ Honors is 4, w/ Distinction is 5, and National is 8, what were the "old" rules for the others (i.e. what differentiated a National Scholar from a Scholar with Distinction, or was it merely the difference of a 3.5 average minimum and all passes for Distinction and a 4+ score on all tests for National)?

I don't know how it is at other high schools, but in 2002 the AP World History exam was first administered (I was in first class to take it), which sophomores at my school took (typically their first and only AP class in first two years). If other students across the nation are getting the equivalent of a full credit more, that may be why the standards were raised.

By Jk9903 (Jk9903) on Wednesday, July 23, 2003 - 08:50 pm: Edit

I did this year: 5's on Lit, Chem, Bio, World His, US His, Physics B, Calc BC and a 4 on Spanish.

By Candad (Candad) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 07:36 am: Edit

Hmm. It only needs to find a counterexample to prove an assumption is wrong. The link below describes the "old" criteria.

http://www.roeper.org/news/news26.html

By Shortii22 (Shortii22) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 08:49 am: Edit

so sad...i should be a nat'l ap scholar next year :-p too late for admissions

By Delirious (Delirious) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 09:13 am: Edit

How do you people take like 3 AP sciences in the same year?

By Emyh (Emyh) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 01:48 pm: Edit

So wait a minute when they say "70 awards were awarded to juniors blah blah" do they mean 70 awards were awarded to juniors who took the tests sophomore year OR juniors as in they took the tests junior year?

By Planodad (Planodad) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 02:29 pm: Edit

Wow, saw Candad's note and thought it applied to my message. So, I went out to look for the press release I "remember" reading concerning the changes to the awards program and could not find it. In fact, I found evidence that the National AP Scholar award level has been at the eight exam level for at least the last five years. My mistake, don't know where I got the idea they had changed the criteria. So, Candad is correct and I was wrong. Sorry for my mistake.

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 03:32 pm: Edit

Emyh - 70 awards to juniors who took the exams prior to fall of their junior year.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 09:53 pm: Edit

Emyh, Texas,

I believe the year of the award means the year the tests were taken. It could easily be seen that the most number of awards were for seniors in which most of the AP tests were taken. Otherwise, the grade in which the most awards were given would be college. So, 71 awards to students who took the exams in May of their junior year and just in time to put them into their application.

By Localmooer (Localmooer) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 10:02 pm: Edit

http://www.agnesirwin.org/campus/college/matriculation.asp?L4ID=2&from=admissions

See "The Buzz" column on the right.

"Thirty-two current seniors and college freshmen were named Advanced Placement Scholars. Laura Bornstein, a freshman at Rice University, qualified for the National AP Scholar Award by earning 4 or higher on eight AP’s."

By Mrsanguine101 (Mrsanguine101) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 10:03 pm: Edit

How many students receive this award total? How many receive it in their fall of their senior year?

Thanks!

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Thursday, July 24, 2003 - 11:35 pm: Edit

Shame on College Board for making this confusing!! I've switched sides a couple of times on this now. It seems to me that if CB wanted the award to correspond to the grade in which the test was given, there is no reason why they couldn't put the new award designations on the score reports that come out in July, but they don't. If senior year AP exams "count", then there isn't anything all *that* impressive about having a total of 8. Many people on this board take 5 APs as seniors after having taken some APs earlier.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 07:39 am: Edit

For National AP Scholar (2002):
Grade | # of Awards
11 | 71
12 | 1645
Not Stated | 21
Other | 1

Total | 1738

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 10:41 am: Edit

Txdad,

Thanks. Ive seen this chart also on the CB website, and you posted the numbers for "AP with honor" above. But this removes none of the ambiguity. It could mean that 1645 people received this award as college freshmen based on exams taken through the end of 12th grade. (I've google-searched and now found some evidence that this is the case.)

BUT... it could mean that 1645 kids received this award as 12th graders based on exams taken through the end of 11th grade. That is how Siemen's does it for their AP award for math/science exams. Kids who are still in high school get the Siemen's AP award in the fall, based on exams taken through the previous spring. College freshmen are ineligible, so 12th grade tests don't count. It's somewhat ambiguous on their website also, but I know someone who won this so I'm more clear on how it works. For info on Siemen's AP award go to www.siemens-foundation.org

It actually makes more sense if you assume 12th grade tests don't "count", since a high school award conferred on students who are already well into their freshmen year of college would be pretty useless. It also makes the numbers conform more closely to my (probably skewed) impression of how many kids take these when.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 11:35 am: Edit

Texas,

The following response from College Board should clear things up:
Question: "I have seen a spreadsheet presenting the data about AP award by grades and states. Does the grade/award depit to the tests taken in the May of previous school year? For example, awards for grade 12 means students are most likely college freshmen and the accumulative tests were taken before and in their senior year."

CB Response: "Yes, the 12th grades students are most likely freshmen in college by the time the spreadsheet is made. The school year is over by the time the students receive their awards."

Hope that helps.

By Mrsanguine101 (Mrsanguine101) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 12:05 pm: Edit

Interesting...personally, I would have thought that their were alot more people if that were the case.

I guess I was underestimating its difficulty to attain.

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 12:59 pm: Edit

Me too, Mrsanguine. My son has 4 1/2 as of the end of sophomore year. I was thinking that wasn't enough to be particularly unusual, but it seems more impressive now.

By Number9 (Number9) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 03:51 pm: Edit

Well considering some schools dont even offer 8 APs, and there are a ton of misinformed students that think they have to take an AP course to take the test. Plus the money it costs, etc.

I can see why the number is so low.

By And1baller (And1baller) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 08:18 pm: Edit

wow... being an ap natl scholar seems to be pretty prestigious especially if one can attain it after junior year. I have 2/8 years complete at end of soph year.. woulda been 2 1/2 but i had to get a 3 on compsci a.. horrible teacher for that class.. anyways... im debating whether i should take 6 full years of ap tests to get the award so i can post on my college apps... im not sure how much colleges weigh AP results though...
Before i go crazy and take 6 years of APs i want input of whether it is worth it. If i were to try i would have to do the following junior year:
AP Physics B
AP English Lang
AP US History
AP Psychology (1/2 year)
AP Calc BC (self study) already took AB got 5
*takin calc II and multivariable calc at a JC*
AP Chemistry (self study) took hnrs course soph year
AP Statistics (1/2 year, self study).. seems really easy

By Txdad (Txdad) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 09:54 pm: Edit

And1baller,

You should do it not for the award but for your own enjoyment. As I said before, EC's and working experience would be more valuable for college admission. Also, I am sure AP Calculus AB and BC would count as 1 full-year credit. You should verify with College Board.

By Number9 (Number9) on Friday, July 25, 2003 - 10:03 pm: Edit

Question after hastily scimming this topic:

So you have to finish 8 by the end of JUNIOR year to get the award, right?


It wont matter too much to receive the award as a senior since the applications are already sent, and so on, but would you still get the certificate if you finish 8 by the end of SENIOR year?

Please clarify these things for me.

Thanks.

By Mattman (Mattman) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 01:48 am: Edit

To have colleges see that you are a National AP Scholar you must have the 8 full-year courses (or the equivalence) tested during your junior year or before. In theory from what I've read above, you'll receive the award September of your senior year and colleges will be able to see that you have made this award.

By Mattman (Mattman) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 02:19 am: Edit

---

Quote:

wow... being an ap natl scholar seems to be pretty prestigious especially if one can attain it after junior year. I have 2/8 years complete at end of soph year.. woulda been 2 1/2 but i had to get a 3 on compsci a.. horrible teacher for that class.. anyways... im debating whether i should take 6 full years of ap tests to get the award so i can post on my college apps... im not sure how much colleges weigh AP results though...

---

By And1baller (And1baller) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 03:19 am: Edit

i know....that's why i DID NOT include compsci A as part of the 2 years .. if i had i would have 2 1/2 years of ap credits since compsci a is considered a half year course... but i have 2 as of now.. Calculus AB.. which i got 5 on ..and world history which i got a 4 on... so 2 years... and my tentative junior year ap schedule has total of 5 full-year courses and 2 1/2 year courses for total of 6 full year.. which would make me ap natl scholar.. that is if i get 4 or 5 on all of them.

By Planodad (Planodad) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 08:52 am: Edit

TxDad,
I believe Calculus AB and Calculus BC counts as two tests IFF they are taken in different years. You cannot count the AB subscore of a Calc BC course as a test for the AP awards, but you can count Calc AB and Calc BC as two separate full year tests IFF they are taken in different years, such as Calc AB in 11th grade and Calc BC in 12th grade.

I haven't seen that written anywhere, so I called the CB several months ago. That was the answer they gave me over the phone.

Anyone seen a different interpretation?

By Mattman (Mattman) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 06:58 pm: Edit

And1baller, I don't think you quite understand my point: it doesn't matter if you don't consider a 3 as giving you credit for National AP Scholar (because it requires a minimum of 4) but you cannot get National AP Scholar regardless of how many APs you took because you already made a 3, and there is a minimum requirement of four on ALL tests you have ever taken.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 08:28 pm: Edit

Mattman,

You are wrong on this subject because you missed the word "AVERAGE". And1baller, you have a chance. Go for it.

Planodad, you were probably right about the Calc AB/BC. Too bad S only took Calc BC; otherwise, one more credit could be counted toward awards.

By Mattman (Mattman) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 09:03 pm: Edit

ahh...I stand corrected, thank you Txdad. Just got a little frustrated when it was I who did not read carefully enough.

By Candad (Candad) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 10:01 pm: Edit

Thanks to Planodad for clarification. I thought Calculus AB only count a half credit too.

"The award of National AP Scholar is granted to students in the United States who receive an average grade of at least 4 on ALL AP Exams taken, and grades of 4 or higher on eight or more of THESE exams on full-year courses (or the equivalent)."

The above is quoted from the CB. Here I capitalize the "all" and "these" for convenience. If the above THESE refers to the ALL, then I agree with Matman's interpretation.

By Frick (Frick) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 10:27 pm: Edit

You can get a 1 and still be a National Scholar, so long as you have eight tests with a 4 or above and the average of all exams is four.

By And1baller (And1baller) on Saturday, July 26, 2003 - 10:36 pm: Edit

Candad,

"The National AP Scholar is granted to students in who receive an average grade of at least 4 on all AP Exams taken, and grades of 4 or higher on eight or more of these exams on full-year courses (or the equivalent)."

Reading this i see 2 requirements:
1. recieve AVERAGE grade of atleast 4 on all ap Exams taken. ( i will have taken 8 1/2 years worth and if i do happen to get either 4 or 5 on all ap tests junior year the average will be greater than 4)
2. recieve grades of 4 or higher on EIGHT or more of these exams on full-year courses (or equivalent). (of the 8 1/2 years of ap tests i will have taken, only 1 would be a 3, compsci A, which is considered 1/2 year course so you can throw that out as not counting and i'm left with 8 exams with 4 or higher)

I believe my interpretation is correct, and i am still eligible for the ap national scholar award.

By Mattman (Mattman) on Sunday, July 27, 2003 - 12:12 am: Edit

And1baller, I see the point you have made and yours is valid. However, what if you go through a full year of hard work and studying only to make 4's and 5's on all the tests except one? By only striving to achieve the minimum amount of APs, you run the risk of not getting the award should you make a mistake (which I'd imagine would be easy if one had to divide their time between over a half dozen subjects).

The bottom line is that you shouldn't dedicate something towards a piece of paper which won't mean anything (as you'll already be long-accepted into any college after you've won the certificate), but rather something that you have a genuine interest in.

By Diconoclastx (Diconoclastx) on Sunday, July 27, 2003 - 04:40 pm: Edit

Txdad, I think I got this award also, but I haven't received anything from the collegeboard yet. Have you?

By And1baller (And1baller) on Sunday, July 27, 2003 - 06:03 pm: Edit

"The bottom line is that you shouldn't dedicate something towards a piece of paper which won't mean anything (as you'll already be long-accepted into any college after you've won the certificate), but rather something that you have a genuine interest in."

How will i have been accepted to college?.. I am going to be a junior next year so i would get the award in time to put into my college apps. Another thing, if i dont make it, i dont make it. No big deal. Plus, I only have to really self study for chem which i've already taken and am studying for the SATII for it anyways. The statistics will be something new but i cant imagine it being that difficult. All the other APs im going to be taking, i would have taken regardless of ap national scholar award because im going to be enrolled in those classes. All i'm adding is 1 1/2 years worth of AP tests to see if i can somehow manage to pull of ap natl scholar.

By Txdad (Txdad) on Monday, July 28, 2003 - 09:04 am: Edit

Diconoclastx,

Congratulations on your AP achievements. As for when you will be notified for your awards, read section at the following URL: http://www.collegeboard.com/ap/students/faq/faq004.html#q10

By Akiba (Akiba) on Wednesday, September 03, 2003 - 09:51 pm: Edit

Maybe I'm confused. It was my understanding that some tests only counted as half a semester (macroeconomics, microeconomics, US Gov, Comparative Gov, Comp Sci A, Enviro Sci, Psychology... cant remember exactly).

I'm a senior this year with 8 tests taken, seven 5's and one 4, but a couple of them are only single-semester equivilant.

Not to burst the hopes of a few of you proud parents, but take a second look at which tests your children took and verify that they are full-year equivilant.

Also something am wondering about... I heard that AP Scholar awards do not have an effect on college admissions. They were part of a small scholarship program. Am I wrong? Colleges see your AP tests and classes anyways, a title wouldnt really mean anything...