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Hey, how good do you guys think BYU is? Honestly, I always thought it was one of the best undergrads in the country, but then I looked at the US News Rankings and it was like #74! I was completely shocked because I always thought it was up there with the big boys (i.e Boston U, Boston College, UCLA).

Am I completely dillusional or is this school incredibly under ranked?

Seriously, I am just so shocked!

By Arizonamom (Arizonamom) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 12:36 am: Edit

It is a great school. It is Mormon oriented. The ratings are lower then reality as most students take longer to graduate as they take off a few years junior year to complete their 2 1/2 year mission. I may be wrong about the exact length of the mission but most if not all males do this and some female students. This makes their 6 yr grad rate much lower then most similar schools. My neighbors who attended there are doing fantastic. One is goin to Harvard for an MBA.

By Mini (Mini) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 02:05 am: Edit

Oh, those rankings. Do you think a bunch of east coast liberals (like me) who administer east coast liberal colleges are going to provide high "peer review" scores to the Mormon Oxford? (By the way, they don't seem to like schools in the midwest or Rocky Mountain States generally speaking.)

I am not trying to defend BYU - I wouldn't have a clue as to whether the education offered there is worth anything or not. But if I were going to slight them, the so-called rankings wouldn't have anything to do with it.

Why not rank it within its peer group - other private 4-year LDS institutions?

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 03:28 am: Edit

The ranking is about right...perhaps a little weaker than deserved, but not by much. I would say BYU should be ranked anywhere between #50 and #100. It is a fine university with a fine student body and a good faculty. In that regard it is no different from Purdue, Minnesota, Texas A&M or Colorado.

The rankins are not 100% accurate of course. The difference between #1 and #25 is insignificant and the difference between #50 and #100 is also pretty small.

By Andrep450 (Andrep450) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 12:46 pm: Edit

Oh OK. So I a getting the idea that I was wrong about considering it a "top" school? You guys seem to just think of it as solid.

By Gadad (Gadad) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 01:05 pm: Edit

Two things to know about BYU: It's an awesome deal - tuition there is around $3-4,000 / year, so it's probably cheaper than going as an in-state student to your state's public universities. And if you're not Mormon, you may be in for considerable culture shock.

By Celebrian23 (Celebrian23) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 03:41 pm: Edit

I think it's ranking is much lower than it deserves, but since i'm not mormon, i'm not really interested in it, though it really should be ranked higher

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 04:15 pm: Edit

I don't understand what is so great about BYU that some feel it should be ranked higher?

Does it have a top Business or Engineering program? BYU is ranked #38 in Business and is unranked in Engineering.

Is it known for its excellence in the social sciences, humanities or core sciences? BYU is not ranked in the top 50 in any academic discipline.

Does it have a very gifted student body?
MEAN ACT: 26.
MEAN GPA of entering student: 3.5
Graduating in the top 10% of HS class: 50%
The students are certainly capable, but I would not say they are gifted.

Are the professors leaders in their field?
Judging from the ranking of their departments, I would say the faculty is, on average, not that stellar.

Does it have very individualized undergraduate instruction?
% of classes with fewer than 20 students: 40%
% of classes with more than 50 students: 16%

This said, BYU is a very respected university and does provide students with a wealth of opportunities. For example, there are currently 22 BYU graduates attending the University of Chicago's Law School. Only Northwestern and the University of Chicago have more representatives. I also know that a great deal of BYU students end up at Harvard, Yale, Michigan and other excellent graduate schools. But ranking it much above its current ranking is not justified.

By Mini (Mini) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 05:39 pm: Edit

And who, pray tell, did the rankings? A bunch of atheistic east coast college deans?

For folks who attend, the questions might be:

LDS students graduating from the top 10% of their class?
% of class with fewer than 20% LDS students
% of LDS faculty with graduate degrees from leading universities
% of students who go on missions abroad
% of students who take more than six years to graduate as a result of fulfilling religious commitments
% of students who marry while in college and still complete their undergraduate studies

For what they are, they may be the #1 college in the country. Depends what you are looking for.

By Emeraldkity4 (Emeraldkity4) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 07:16 pm: Edit

my problem with BYU is doctrine
Are professors told what to teach?
Are they fired if they dont stick to the party line?
Are students comfortable discussing controversial subjects in or out of class?

By Arizonamom (Arizonamom) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 10:24 pm: Edit

I would not expect controversial discussions or diversity in thought. If you adhere to a Mormon doctrine it is one of the best colleges but if you are non-Mormon it would be a difficult environment to be in. I know many people who have gone there and have recieved an amazing education. One of my neighbors used to be a professor there so I have learned a lot and many students from our HS have attended. They are all very bright and have done well in life and with grad school.

By Ellemenope (Ellemenope) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 11:02 pm: Edit

Welllll, now that you mention it, I'm not sure that I would consider Boston College and Boston U "big boys". . .

As for BYU, the cream of the student body at BYU can get into very selective professional or grad schools. Many LDS kids go there because it is cheap ($8000 a year if you are a Mormon and that INCLUDES room and board) and they can save their money to attend an expensive grad/professional school. Plus there are a lot of other Mormon kids around to date. Being a large university, there are oodles of things to major in an a big sports program to be involved with (although it's football team has seen better days).

All in all, not a bad deal.

By Mini (Mini) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 01:24 am: Edit

My point is that it should be evaluated on its own terms. The so-called rankings are virtually entirely irrelevant as to why someone would want to go to BYU to begin with. They are the #1 school in the country for LDS members who want a quality education for their children which upholds their spiritual values. They're not my values, but they don't have to be.

In the 20th century, they probably had more governors, senators, and congressman who graduated from there than any place but Harvard and Yale, even if 80% of them were from Utah. And I'm sure they have nowhere near the level of binge drinking, sexual harrassment, or mental health problems and depression that are to be found at HYP.

By Slipper2002 (Slipper2002) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 01:47 pm: Edit

BYU is able to attract top Mormon candidates, which results in the exceptional placement for its stature, but the overall university is not as good. The same can be said for a place like Ohio State

By Slipper2002 (Slipper2002) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 01:48 pm: Edit

Never mind the Ohio state thing. No "top mormons" there haha. Also not nearly as good placement...

By Barrons (Barrons) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 01:52 pm: Edit

I think the one place where BYU excels is in business placement. Many firms that don't recruit much below the top 20 make an exception for BYU.

By Ellemenope (Ellemenope) on Friday, October 01, 2004 - 05:21 pm: Edit

>>I think the one place where BYU excels is in business placement. Many firms that don't recruit much below the top 20 make an exception for BYU. <<

Also their top law students can get into top national law firms.

I'm sure that it is partly because of the mature, clean cut image the job applicants present and that fact that many can speak foreign language--a big plus in this global marketplace.

By Thekev (Thekev) on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 06:18 pm: Edit

BYU sends many to top graduate schools such as Harvard and Chicago and has a more national and international reputation than many schools of similar rank.
BYU serves as a shining example of how putting too much emphasis on rankings can cause one to overlook an excellent school. As helpful as the rankings can sometimes be, one must take into account that the formula is not without error.

By Neelesh (Neelesh) on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 08:31 pm: Edit

haha. all my friends want to go to BYU since they are mostly all mormon...

but it is a good school, but it has a lot of people, for being a private university.

For only about 5k a year, it is a very good deal for the quality of education

although i would not want to go there, since there is not much diversity.

95% or greater all 1 religion, 89% white-like i said, very little diversity

also, they have VERY strict campus rules

but BYU is a good place, and all the people there are really nice and fun to hang out with, and its a great place to live