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The reason I started this thread is to warn against people who consider going to USC. A little bit about myself, I am current a freshman in USC. Have been here for last five weeks, I am pretty disappointed by the education quality that USC offers to its undergrad students.

Let me draw some examples. For most of GE classes, the class size is about 200. What makes the matter worse is that for freshmen they are not likely to get all the GE they need. Many filled quickly. Many people during orientation freaked out during the registration of class schedule, because they can’t get all classes they need.

There is not much of interaction between students and professors for a classroom that contains more than 200 people. Actually, some professor encouraged students to see T.A. (grad students)., instead to go to their office hour.

Pretty much for all GE and lower division classes, most of the exams, reports and final grade are graded and done by TA. (Imagine a professor grading 200 reports and exams, impossible, this job is divided to numerous TA’s)

For the first writing class that all freshmen are required to take, it is taught by grad student. And you can’t take the writing class elsewhere.

Many T.A’s for math and science class are foreigners who can’t speak good English. During discussion session, they taught the same thing that professors already taught in the class. And there is a number of math, science professors who speak with very strong accent.

While being a private school that charges its student 15k/semester, USC offers a public school education to its undergrad which is especially true for those in the freshman and sophomore class. I feel that I am having such an inferior education right now comparing to other private schools.

Unless you get tons of grants and scholarship or are a film major, it is really not worth anyone’s money to attend USC. There have to be better alternative than USC. If you really like USC, transfer here from community college will save you lots of money. Or think USC as for your grad school

By Haneen (Haneen) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 12:05 am: Edit

I am transfering to usc this spring from ucsb , is the situation that bad??? Many ppl told me i will regret my descision going there but for some reason I think its worth it.

It seems ur not happy with ur education there !
Do u think staying at ucsb is better ??

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 12:18 am: Edit

Just curious, what your major and why you wanna transfer?

By Haneen (Haneen) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 12:33 am: Edit

my major is chemical eng, I am paying out of state tuition here which is similar to usc fees. I really like ucsb alot and I am really scared regreting transfering out, but I feel ucsb is isolated from everything. what do u think??
I have to fill the paper for my I- 20 within 3 days and honestly I feel my head is gonna explode. I cant decide and I dont know what exactly I want. I am also sick of lsning to what ppl say . I its either I go to USC or stay at UCSB for the next 2 years.
I really hope u can advice me and tell me about ur opinion. I really cant lsn to anyone here cuz I feel they are being biased .

By Mikemac (Mikemac) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 01:24 am: Edit

to Haneen:

UCSB is ranked in the top 20 or so for undergrad ChemE and 9th for their grad program. USC isn't ranked in the top 30. Presumably you have build up a core of friends at SB, you know the area, you've gotten to know some profs. You say you like UCSB a lot. Just why would you *want* to leave and start over from scratch?

By Haneen (Haneen) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 01:37 am: Edit

Mikemac,

Ur right.. I have been telling this to myself each second. I wish I can decide ..I am still confused.. but is it worth to pay 38 000 $ for ucsb ?? to make things worse for me, I am in the best doorms and in single here, smthg i dont think ill have at usc..
part of me wants to stay here and my other part wants to leave to usc.. I lost about 14 lbs thinking about this ..I think whatever desicion i make i will always be trapped with the "what if"..

By Caseyatbat (Caseyatbat) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 02:53 am: Edit

Gosh, how do you figure $38,000 for UCSB? Out of state tuition is $16.5K. Not even close to USC's basic tuition....

By Haneen (Haneen) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 03:01 am: Edit

caseyatbat,

I know how much money goes out of my bank to the university. I am including pocket money and the cost of living ( not just tuition alone), plus the health insurance ect..

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 11:52 am: Edit

Caseyatbat, First, non-resident tuition at the UC's is currently $19,740 a year. Add in room and board and the UC system estimates average cost to be about $28,000 these days...not including books, personal expenses, travel, etc.

But...Haneen, you'll be paying MUCH more at USC.
Tuition ALONE is $30,515 a year - estimated total expenses there are $42,512. Assuming you spend as much on personal stuff as you do at UCSB, you'll be easily looking at spending close to $45,000-50,000 a year there. And, don't forget, you'll be in LA where the temptation to indulge more may run up your bills even more. In my opinion, transferring to USC isn't worth the extra money.

As Mikemac notes, UCSB has a TERRIFIC ChemE program...you're on track to graduate in 2 years there. Are you absolutely sure that you can do the same as a transfer at USC (double check that you will be able to meet ALL of their graduation requirements with your transfer credits in 2 years). But, honestly, Santa Barbara isn't exactly Siberia...and two years isn't that long a time. I'd stay at UCSB if I was you unless I had a MUCH better reason than feeling like Santa Barbara was isolated. Of course, that's just what I would do - you must chart your own course that feels right for you.

By Caseyatbat (Caseyatbat) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 12:24 pm: Edit

Carolyn--don't mean to hijack the thread, so...real quickly, can you tell me where you got your tuition figure?? This interests me, as I have a senior D. My numbers are from UCSB's website..under fees. $16,476 for 2004-05. Are campus's different?? That's a substantial difference is $$--I'd like to know. Thanks.

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 04:14 pm: Edit

-Haneen

If I am you, I would stick to ucsb. I really don't understand what make USC so attractive to you. As Carolyn mentioned, ucsb is awesome at ChemE. And for USC, ChemE is one of its weak engineering major. For this particular major, there is no way in hell USC is a better choice. USC's school of engineering is more into EE. (Obviously, USC's principal himself is a EE major, and an EE alumni donated lots of money this year)

Actually, I had been to chemical engineering building once (the first day school that I got lost.) You will be disappointed once you see it. It is located at a remote area of the campus and the building itself is quite old. The size of research lab is like a dorm room with worn equipment. Although an alumni named Andrew Viterbi donated 52 millions to engineering school this year (the school is later named after him). And there are some constructions going on. But I bet the construction will not be completed until your graduation.

And for the costs, Carolyn is exactly right. You are likely to spend more than 45k a year at USC. Already 32k for tuition and fees, 5k for room, 4k for board and these don't include books and personal expenses. From what I see, USC tries to make $ out of its students in whichever possible way they can. EX: computer access fee, tuition refund insurance, mandatory health fee, etc...

Again, if you want to do ChemE, then stay at UCSB. USC is not worth it.

By Flopsy (Flopsy) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 06:04 pm: Edit

I would also recommend completing your studies at UCSB... A USC education isn't twice as valuable as one from UCSB, so why would you want to pay twice the tuition fees to move to a lower-class neighborhood in Los Angeles?

By Thedad (Thedad) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 06:42 pm: Edit

At the risk of being tagged as an anti-USC honk (partially true), I wouldn't jump from UCSB to USC in your situation. I see absolutely no positive reason for doing so. You're in the better school for ChemE, you're in a better location, you've got superior living conditions....

Why do *you* think it may be worth it?

Btw, you can feel just as isolated at USC as you can at UCSB. Maybe the solution is to get a greater sense of being connected at UCSB...some unhappinesses move with you when you move.

By Tsdad (Tsdad) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 08:34 pm: Edit

How can you really decide what a school is like after just five weeks? Seems rather rash. Frankly my son wasn't happy first semester last year. By second semester he had added a second major, starting taking some of his film courses, and began to adjust socially. This semster he has become an editor of the the liberal student newspaper. He seems to have found his place and is happy with the school, his courses, and LA.

I think you need to give it at least a full year and a chance to take something other than general education courses before you make a decision on whether the place is for you. BTW, some of your complaints are similar to those you'll hear from any first semester freshman at a large, research university.

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 09:10 pm: Edit

...."BTW, some of your complaints are similar to those you'll hear from any first semester freshman at a large, research university."

Remember that USC is a ~~~private school~~~ that charges its students 15k/semester. Usually large, research universities are public which charge much less.

"How can you really decide what a school is like after just five weeks?"

I don't decide what the school is like. I don't decide my writing class is taught by grad student. I don't decide my GE having more than 200 people. It is actually what the school is like, academically for undergrad.

And don't get me wrong. The title is "USC's undergrad education is so disappointing." Not "USC is so disappointing." While I am pretty unhappy of USC academically and its bad neighbor, I'd say that the social part of the school is awesome.

By Liek0806 (Liek0806) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 09:53 pm: Edit

What about financial aid. Isn't USC suppose to supposidly give good financial aid. How much in grants or scholarships are they giving you Haneen?

By Idontknow236 (Idontknow236) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 10:11 pm: Edit

when was a time that u had an intellectual experience that has mattered to you

By Idontknow236 (Idontknow236) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 10:13 pm: Edit

when was a time that u had an intellectual experience that has mattered to you

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 11:30 pm: Edit

Caseyatbat: The figures I quoted are the current figures approved by the UC regents for out of state tuition at all UC campuses.Here's the link:
http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/admissions/feeupdate/july_regents.html

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 11:39 pm: Edit

Caseyatbat: It appears we were both off.

Since you said there was a discrepency, I double checked on the UCSB web site--- and found an update from the UC system president dated May 2004 with CURRENT UC fees/tuition. For out of state students THIS YEAR, the actual tuition/fees are$23,186 a year. Perhaps you were looking at an old link that had not yet been updated to reflect the ever changing tuition picture in the UC system (expect more increases to follow) Here's the link:
http://www.ucsb.edu/campus-topics/budget/20040526-dynes.shtml

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 11:44 pm: Edit

Liek, like most US schools, USC does not offer financial aid for internationals and has only limited merit scholarships available for internationals.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 11:55 pm: Edit

Caseyatbat - OK, I see the problem now. At most schools (USC for example) "tuition" means the total cost of your academic experience...but at the UC's you have to pay TUITION PLUS FEES. It is true that TUITION is $16,000 plus for non residents at the UC's BUT they must also pay nearly $7,000 in FEES, bringing the total cost (Tuition/fees) of the academic experience to $23,186 as I stated above.

By the way, Haneen is right on the money (no pun intended) when he says it costs him about $38,000 a year to attend UCSB as an out of state student - that's UCSB's own estimate of total costs for non resident students including Tuition and fees, room/board, expenses, books, etc. Here's a link:

http://www.finaid.ucsb.edu/Budget.asp?Level=Undergraduate&Budget=UNN3&Year=2004

Hope this helps!

By Haneen (Haneen) on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 11:59 pm: Edit

I am soo confused.. I cant believe I have 24 hrs left to make such a huge desicion. I liked usc when i visited .. i dont know why. .everything is perfect at ucsb but theres a huge thing missing here.. I dont feel i have a motivation to work,, I heard being a usc alumni will help me alot in the future. Ucsb is soo laid back and i feel everything goes here so slowly..
about my credits I already have aloot, I am actually a sophomre with a junior standered and I have great grades. Everything ppl do here is partying ..honestly... ucsb is perfect but not for me..
I actually have another 2 major reason why i need to transfer , the first is for family matters ( id rather not discuss ) and the other reason is that as an international student , usc will help me more. Any encouragments.. i really need someone to encourage me to fill my I 20 paper and send it.. I dont know I am soo confused. WIll I REGRET GOING TO USC??

By Haneen (Haneen) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 12:07 am: Edit

carolyn,

I am not trying to say the figures on the website are not true but I am paying approximitaly 38 000 $ a year with the room and everything and btw fees for out of states are going to increase significally next year.

btw I am a girl if that makes any difference

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 12:11 am: Edit

Seems like you've already made up your mind. I think the people here have given you some good and honest advice but this is a decision only you can make based on your own situation. Do what you believe is best and don't look backwards. Just remember that your choice of where to go to college is never a life or death situation. Trust your gut instincts.Best of luck to you.

By Caseyatbat (Caseyatbat) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 12:40 am: Edit

By golly, Carolyn--I think you got it! I have looked at these costs before, and never noticed that tuition and fees are separate (and real) costs for non residents. I think I always thought that 'fees'were something that summarized misc. costs like books, ins. etc, so never wanted to add it to any "tuition" comparisons. Thanks for the research/clarification. Now...did you also conclude that in-state residents have no "tuition"--just the in state "educational fee" similar to the non-resident fee that is added to non resident "tuition"? Interesting. And expensive.

Haneen-I apologize for going on this tuition tangent. I know you are struggling with a difficult decision. Like Carolyn says, make your decision and go forward. Both are good schools--count your blessings and good luck.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 10:51 am: Edit

Yes, Caseyatbat, in-state only pay "UC fees" which in my mind is the same as "instate tuition." Of course, it's sacrilege to say that here in California where people like to believe they live in a "tuition free" college state... until, of course, the bills come in.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 10:56 am: Edit

Haneen,
What did you decide? Whatever the choice, pat yourself on the back and face the future with happiness. Best wishes for your continued success!!! Carolyn

By Happytexasdad (Happytexasdad) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 11:25 am: Edit

This is a pretty scathing indictment, Auscguy. My S, a high school junior, has stared is college search and USC is one of choices. He will major in broadcast jornalism and Annenberg appears to be impressive. Can you, or any others here, attest to the quality of USC's journalism program? A few other schools that he is considering are Northwestern (reach), Missouri-Columbia (match)and UT-Austin (match). How does Annenberg compare to those J Schools?

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 11:49 am: Edit

USC's journalism program is excellent, considered one of the best in the country. While you may face large classes in GE courses, I don't think that will be much different at any of the other schools on your son's list, or really at any large university. The real question is the size and availability of Journalism classes - be sure to do your research but I suspect the answers will be positive when it comes to journalism class size and opportunities or USC wouldn't have its great reputation.

By Haneen (Haneen) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 12:33 pm: Edit

first of all i really want to thank all for ur honest comments..and ur support..

I think I am going back to my doorm fill my I 20 and fax it later today.. i am still scared and confused but as u said carolyn its not a death or life desicion. I know I will be facing sacrifices if i moved there but nothing is perfect in life..

thank you all ..

By Thedad (Thedad) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 01:31 pm: Edit

Journalism is one of the majors for which I would consider USC to be a decent option.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 02:30 pm: Edit

Good luck to you Haneen...may you find what you are looking for and lots of success and happiness as well! Let us know how it goes for you.
Carolyn

By Haneen (Haneen) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 06:38 pm: Edit

Carolyn ur such a great person.. I really wish u success too in whatever ur doing ..

By Uschicka (Uschicka) on Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 07:46 pm: Edit

I'm a sophomore at USC this year. A few things that you have to remember are that 1) these are your G.E. courses, and completely different from your major classes, and 2) your classroom experiences can be different from other students'.

Yes, a lot of GE classes will be large (although still much smaller than classes of 500 my dad told me he had). In one of my classes last year my professor invited us all out to lunch, his treat. He made the lunches different days so he could have a small group with him and get to know us. Some professors may refer you to TAs, but most want to get to know you, at least in my experience.

Once you begin taking classes more related to your major, you will see a drastic shift. My courses have about 20 students, and we're all known by name and are welcomed by our teachers to talk to them. I think while some of the discussion groups seem tedious, it is also a great effort to provide a smaller setting.

One last thing. If all teachers were as amazing as my grad student in Writing 140 people across America would be brilliant and would love school. Writing 140 was an awesome experience, where I learned so much, had a close relationship with my teacher, and got to have a nice community of about 15 other students.

I'm sorry that you feel you are getting slighted. I guarantee that things will improve. And, most importantly, if you make the effort, you can get a lot out of even your largest classes.

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Tuesday, October 05, 2004 - 01:56 am: Edit

-happytexasdad

I will get back to your question later. have 2 midterms this week

By Thedad (Thedad) on Tuesday, October 05, 2004 - 04:19 pm: Edit

A datum: I was talking with a neighbor who is a USC prof in the school of business. He wouldn't send his kids to USC unless they wanted the football-and-frat atmosphere. Academically, he prefers a number of LAC's and a few of the other large universities.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Tuesday, October 05, 2004 - 06:25 pm: Edit

Hope you have your fire proof coat on TheDad, I hear those flame throwers warming up...

By Playtothebeat (Playtothebeat) on Wednesday, October 06, 2004 - 02:14 am: Edit

i'd like to offer my take on this as well
i am also a freshman at USC, however i completely disagree with everything the original poster stated.

first of all, i want to say that both of us provide simply OPINIONS. and we are probably differnet majors, taking different classes/profs.

all my classes are pretty awesome. my writing is taught by a grad student, just like everyone else's. she is J.D. Sallinger's niece. Great teacher so far, in my opinion.

My econ, philosophy (GE) and BuAD lectures have about 200 kids in them, but surprisingly the professors know a good amount of names, especially if you sit in the front. i usually sit in the middle and dont speak up very often, however.

in my discussions, on the other hand, i am very vocal, as am i in my writing class. there are only roughly 25 people in each of those classes (17 in WRIT), so the interaction is great. the TAs ARE foreign students who definately have problems with their english, but you know what? its fine. i learn a good amount from my interaction with the other students.

the workload hasn't been too bad for me, but it hasn't been that light either. it's just right for me. some of hte people on my floor, however, have had massive amounts of homework everyday (bio, chem, or biochem majors, mostly).

that is just my input on the subject..

By Thedad (Thedad) on Wednesday, October 06, 2004 - 01:57 pm: Edit

Nah, Carolyn, wearing short sleeves at the moment.

The neighbor prof said the writing class was the one good small class-size freshman class. But he thought the TA's were problematic in lots of classes. The biggest problem for him, though, was the overall atmosphere; I was surprised.

By Mini (Mini) on Wednesday, October 06, 2004 - 02:08 pm: Edit

People chose what they choose, and as long as they are aware of the choices, that's fine. My problem is when colleges go out of their way to hide who is doing the teaching. If you are going to be taught writing by a TA, or by ones that have problems in English, wouldn't you do better at a community college?

My d. currently is a first-year taking four classes at a large LAC where the tuition is the same as at USC. For her money, she has:
-- A writing course (with connections to the music department - she is a music major) with 5 students, taught by one of the world's leading experts on 19th century French music. He not only grades each paper, he meets with every student individually to discuss each paper (there are 8 of them), and helps each with a redraft.
-- A music composition course with 6 students.
-- A first-year Italian course taught by the department chair (college is famous for romance languages) with 15 students, and a discussion section with 6.
-- A first-year geology class, lecture with 25 students, section with 12, and GIS lab with 6.
In addition, she has a one-on-one tutorial in Early Music with the founder of one of America's most famous early music consorts.

Now there's nothing wrong with a good lecture, if that's what you choose. Just be aware of the choices.

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Wednesday, October 06, 2004 - 09:49 pm: Edit

one more midterm to go

By Shibbalnom (Shibbalnom) on Thursday, October 07, 2004 - 05:28 pm: Edit

Found this
I have recently graduated from USC, and let me tell you, the students ( the majority of them) are rude and cold. I think it's the Los Angeles theme of being unfriendly. You may argue that LA is a big city..yada yada yada. But I've been to NYC, and even if some people are cold there, they are willing to socialize and strike up a conversation. In LA, as well as USC, students pretty much care about partying, partying and partying. It's all about "friends" who actually aren't really friends at all. The people in LA are shallow and fake. I also found students to be VERY RUDE and classless at football games. When I attended college football games in my homestate, you would applaud even for the visiting team. At USC, students and spectators "boo" the visitors and simply have no manners at all. I was shocked! Sometimes, I feel ashamed of being a Trojan, because of the reputation we have among other universities. In addition, students would place their feet on the back of my chair...and it really is disgusting. I guess I'm upset about Los Angeles and the lifestyle as a whole. But this is also HIGHLY reflected by USC itself. Furthermore, I recently saw the US News Report ranking. USC is climbing "steadily" (who knows...maybe the SAT #'s are tweaked a little). To be frank, I'd say UCLA (so called SC rival) is a better institute. I don't care if people call me a Trojan-sell-out..it's the truth. I wish I went to UCLA. The studnts there are open minded and more compatible. I was also surprised to see a LOW ranking of USC when it comes to the international ranking! USC was ranked #56 (which I think is okay...but not great) as opposed to U Washington Seattle, UCLA and U Wisconsin Madison ranked WAY HIGHER than USC. So what I'm trying to get at for those of you who are thinking of attending USC, is to ask yourself whether you want to go to an institute serious about academics, or serious about using its network to get jobs. Don't get me wrong, networking is a great thing to get jobs. But I would rather depend on my institute and degree's reputation to get me a job, than using some kind of alumni network to get a job.

By Shibbalnom (Shibbalnom) on Thursday, October 07, 2004 - 05:35 pm: Edit

and this
When I graduated from high school, I had to decide between USC and Berkeley as my undergrad education. I chose USC. I am now wholeheartedly regretting my decision. I was always kind of quiet in high school, but I had friends and I was very into fashion (I wasn't a loser.) I came to USC because I thought I would enjoy the campus more, and it had more flexible majors (Music industry and performance, etc.)I got to USC and joined a sorority. The sorority girls are extremely unsupportive of anything academic whatsoever, they party and drink when they are not in class, and the sorority houses are downright nasty. The professors are nice at first, but you come to find out that they are very arrogant and unwilling to help you. I moved out of the sorority my third year and moved into on-campus apartments. They are nice enough, but the place empties out on friday nights when everyone goes to drink. So many nights I sit in my room and cry because I hate it here so much, it is so hard to be someone who is quiet and shy at a place like this. I miss my family and friends in the bay area. I am just sad that I had to waste so much money on this place, that is the only reason why I am staying. I can't ever leave campus because the area is so bad here. Overall, I am not pleased at all with my decision to go to USC.

By Shibbalnom (Shibbalnom) on Thursday, October 07, 2004 - 05:37 pm: Edit

and this

I am going to graduate this spring. Looking back at my experience at USC, it was NOT as great as I've expected. But first, let me talk about the good side about USC. The LA resources are good (but not as great as I've expected) in terms of internship. The weather..hmmmm..it's okay, but not as great as San Diego or Hawaii (where its mostly warm, beaches are great and folks are nice). Some of the instructors I've had were friendly, and wrote me letters of recommendation. Now on to the BAD side (which outweighs the good in my opinion) of USC - Marshall B-school in general. Marshall Bus school is simply horse crap. As some students already mentioned, the courses are based solely on rules and rote memorization. Learning shouldn't be this way. In addition, there's the 2.85 curve which lowers the number of A's given out to student. This grading curve is intended to "increase the reputation of Marshall."...pfft...yeah right. This actually hurts ambitious Trojans who want to advance to Med, law, or any grad-school programs. In fact I have been denied admission to many law schools this year because of my GPA (due to Marshall courses!). The damn businses courses is the main reason. Moreover, the students at Marshall aren't too friendly. Trust me, I'm a Cinema minor student, and the Cinema students and Comm students (because I had to take some comm courses) are much friendlier than the business technocrats. Marshall students are self-absorbed and competitive. It's all about 'sh*tting on each other's face.' Some of the professors I've met aren't very friendly, let alone, show favoritism toward certain students. This leads me to say that the student body at USC seem quite segregated. You have frat students only hanging out with each other etc..... Social life at USC is centered around frats and sororities. If you're not a part of them (which they are NOT helpful at all except to learn how to drink and puke your guts out!) they won't care to talk to you. All in all, I regret choosing USC (Marshall to be specific...but it left me a bad impression of USC) over Emory, Georgetown, Brown, Berkeley, UMich and yes...UCLA. I think USC needs to further market its great 'academic' (NOT football!) reputation out of state. I've been to New York, Texas, Washington State...and folks outside of the Orange County bubble STILL think USC is a party school. If I were to rewind my 'USC' life back to my freshmen year, I would have majored in Communication, Cinema or Political Science to advance to a good grad-school program. Marshall B-school is a total joke, and was a waste of my time and money. I occasionally sob because I could have performed better at another institute academically. I could get the same kind of education at a state college, minus the crap that Marshall dishes out to its students.

By Sammywu (Sammywu) on Thursday, October 07, 2004 - 08:29 pm: Edit

lol, I know exactly where u got these stories from

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Thursday, October 07, 2004 - 11:18 pm: Edit

-happytexasdad

I don't know much about the comm. major bt I heard it is one of the top in the nation. So I would suggest still apply and decide later.

And for the class size, you can find it out from the below link, click on "course offerred"

http://www.usc.edu/students/enrollment/classes/term_20043/index.html

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 12:02 am: Edit

-playthethroat

“however i completely disagree with everything the original poster stated.”

well, you can disagree with my opinion from my post but you CAN’T disagree the actual things that HAPPEN in USC

Fact:
1.) freshman writing class is taught by grad student
2.) most GE and lower division classes are about 200ppl
One can find out the class size from the below link; notice there are great number of classes having about 200ppl
http://www.usc.edu/students/enrollment/classes/term_20043/index.html

3.) Your grade from large class is given by TA; they also grade your paper
4.) some of professors and T.A.’s can’t speak fluent English
5.) USC charges ~~~~$15000 tuition/semester~~~~~~~
These are facts, face it.


Additional Comment:

1.) well, small-sized class certainly is a good thing in college. But being taught by a grad student who is trying to get a Ph.D. Really, wtf. You can hire someone with as much credential on an one-on one tutoring for about $50 /hr.

2.) You said that your philosophy prof knows many students’ names. Great to hear that. But for other classes, just to think logically, how much “individual attention” a student get from a 200ppl class, or is there any.
If you are taking chem, then I assume you either have dr. bau or beaudet. Do they even bother to remember your names? For many times, I have seen that a student raised his hand to ask question. But because the lecture is too big that professor doesn’t notice it.
3.) For science and math class, it is not a big deal. But for a liberal art class, really, why is my paper graded by grad student. And for the grading of reports or papers, I have heard things like your grade really depends on if you get an easy ta or a hard one or even on how much a ta like you.

4.) My math prof is an example, but I would say he is a great guy and cares about the students. But in the lecture, students are having a hard time to understand the math concept that he introduced. Same thing happens during office hour.

5.) It is just the worst part of all. Now you think it’s really worth as much.

Just as Mini said, I would get a better education in CC

USC~~~~~~U$C

By Foreigngirl (Foreigngirl) on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 08:50 am: Edit

wow this kinda scares me...I'm sure there are always people with good and bad experiences in each college but paying that amount of money for that kind of education....I am applying to USC for fall 2005 but this doesnt even sound like worth applying....

By Uschicka (Uschicka) on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 06:19 pm: Edit

Foreigngirl- Everyone has their own experiences.

I love USC, and I'm not a part of the sorority scene. Yes, many of the members of the Greek community stick together, but if you are so adament against those types of people, then that isn't a problem. 20% of students are in frats and sororites. That means 80%, almost 13,000 students aren't. I, in turn, have many great friends that are in sororities. They are smart, hard-workers, nice, funny, some very religious, and yes, some of them like to have a good time.

I turned down Berkeley, and I do not regret it. I was also shy in high school, and I am now too, I guess, but that doesn't mean you can't find friends.

And about students being rude at football games. The majority aren't, but yes, there are going to be obnoxious students. However, you'll find them everywhere. We also have dedicated, classy fans who just love their team and school.

Yes, take into account some of the factors, but don't let them prevent you from applying. It is all what you make out of it.

By Flopsy (Flopsy) on Friday, October 08, 2004 - 10:39 pm: Edit

A 20% rate of students in frats and sororities is relatively high.

By Liek0806 (Liek0806) on Saturday, October 09, 2004 - 10:20 pm: Edit

I just believe that USC is not a fit for everyone. If your the shy timid dorky type you probably wont fit in this school socially. USC is all about social life. If you were the outcast at your high school your bound to be a bigger outcast at USC.

By Auscguy (Auscguy) on Monday, October 11, 2004 - 02:51 am: Edit

feel like starting "how usc rips off its students" thread

By Shibbalnom (Shibbalnom) on Monday, October 11, 2004 - 05:42 pm: Edit

and this
Architecture Major
USC is a big name school. However, USC needs to market itself OUTSIDE of southern california. Some of my friends on the east coast never heard of USC or better yet, think it's a state school! USC also needs to strengthen itself outside of the USA as well. Some of my professors were very helpful and wrote me letters of rec for professional school. The students on the other hand, at USC, tend to be very cold and cliquish. Students who knew each other from high school tend to hang out with one another. Same thing goes for greek life. If you're no a part of the greek system, don't expect them to even look at you. What others here say about this aspect of greek life is true...and unfortunately, is highly supported by the university's president (not the segregation...but greek life as a whole). Students may also be rude too. There were several students in my dorm who would always play their electric guitars, and when I asked them politely to turn down the music, they turned UP the music. Dormlife at USC is pure hell. The RA's don't know what the hell they're doing. I've filed several noise complaints with the RA's, and they do jack. On the lighter side, the new international parkside dorm is nice. I also like the new dining facility there. It's gorgeous. OTher than that, I can't wait to graduate next spring and get the hell out of LA.

By Shibbalnom (Shibbalnom) on Monday, October 11, 2004 - 05:45 pm: Edit

and this
English major

I can't let all the unbridled hostility towards the supposed prevalence of the Greek system go unheeded. I am pretty much one of those who cannot see the point of the Greek system and I have never gone to a party on the Row; nor have I consumed alcohol, taken illicit substances, etc. If Greek life were so huge at USC as some like to suggest, I would be the first whining about it. However, the frats and sororities can be easily ignored if you are not into them. If you are getting annoyed with them, it can only be because you are looking for trouble in that area. People wear shirts with their frat and sorority logos on them a lot, but that's as far as it goes. I only recently found out that one of my friends was in the same sorority as one of my classmates...you'd think that if sororities were the only things on these people's minds, I would have found out a lot sooner. The generalization that people at USC are just trashy is just flat-out stupid. As for questions about the students' wealth (which have to do with stats and not opinions, so this is definitely fair game), the average student's parents at UCLA make more than those at USC; most of the students at USC are on some sort of financial aid. Sure, there are a handful who come from super-wealthy places like Palos Verdes, but you have that lot in every university.
Some people are just crybabies. I made plenty of good friends during my stay at USC (who don't fit into that superficial, trashy mold that some of you espouse). I'm no social butterfly, and if I can make the college work, then there's no excuse for the rest of you.
The main problem I have with the school is the marching band. Now, how can we harass frats for being clique-y (and some are, I'm not trying to absolve all frats of responsibility) and let the marching band go by? These people are the epitome of the clique-ish snobs. Plus, they are ANNOYING. How many times have I woken up at 6 AM because they were blasting our inane fight song (I have school spirit, really I do, but after waking up unnecessarily early countless times by the same stupid song, it gets old!) practically right outside the window? I think that USC should make some sort of rule or regulation regarding such disturbances, so that the marching band can't do that. But it probably won't happen...too many people seem to salivate over the MB because they were in Forrest Gump and played with OutKast...*sigh*

By Shibbalnom (Shibbalnom) on Monday, October 11, 2004 - 05:48 pm: Edit

and this
USC = Mediocre education for a high rip-off price. Looking back at my last three years at this institute, I feel that the students are so much into football, frats and partying. The people of LA also tend to be greedy, selfish, and materialistic..and in turn this culture is also reflected by SC students in general. Some of my professors didn't seem to want to help me. Some of the students I've worked with in groups were fake, and seem to be out to give me low grade with group evaluation. If I were to go back in time, I would NOT come to USC. NEVER!