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I need help finding schools that aren't too liberal! I'm rather conservative (well, not extremely conservative, but enough that liberal political activism and demonstrations will bother me.) I'm not a fan of drinking or smoking. I want to double major in English and music. So far, my list includes: Yale, UPenn, Northwestern, Williams, Oberlin, Swarthmore, Wesleyan, Carleton, and UT (safety). Do you know which of those are moderate and which are radically liberal? And anyone have any more suggestions for me? Thanks!

By Zevdebee (Zevdebee) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 12:04 pm: Edit

dont come to california

By Chrisy (Chrisy) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 12:13 pm: Edit

check out washington & lee. it's very conservative but hi-frat and a bit of a party school. you won't drink beer but scotch. you have to cross out wesleyan- one of the most liberal colleges in the country. greek life at northwestern is also prevalent but it's not that bad and it's no reason to cross it out.

By Subtrunks (Subtrunks) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 12:25 pm: Edit

Swarthmore..please they are the hippy capital of the world ..try amherst instead

By Dave72 (Dave72) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 12:32 pm: Edit

All the schools on your list are very liberal.

By Sbhopeful (Sbhopeful) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 12:33 pm: Edit

I love it how all liberals are automatically labeled "hippies." Anyone else observe that?

By 1214 (1214) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 12:58 pm: Edit

those liberal yo-yos! they should all be squeezed into one room and have their hair unpainted (from blue to some other normal primary color)and their nose-ear-and unmentionable rings plucked from their sordid anatomies. liberal! no such thing! we must all band together in a communal opus, if you will, in a triumphant chorus of splendid conservatism. such choruses (in the form of choirs or various a capella groups, my personal 'ARRR' - a swashbuckling pirate-themed group at the oh so uberly conservative university called brown) may be found in other incredibly Republican schools, among them, of course my future alma mater (brown). there are also: sarah lawrence, hampshire, wellesley, wesleyan, part (usually the non-rich) of yale, and the university of the ghetto which has convenient campuses spread across the country: NE Campus (@Harlem), NW Campus (@ the grungy part of Seattle), SW Campus (@Compton), SE Campus (@Duurty South - #1 Stunna fa all the playaz from da himalayaz usually somewhere in smelly places outside of atlanta or smellier places involving confederate flags and trailers)

hope this helps.

By Mini (Mini) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 01:02 pm: Edit

I don't think any of your schools work -- they range from Oberlin (extremely liberal) to Williams (lots of drinking) and all points in between. All very fine schools.

Why aren't you considering Davidson? It is not conservative by any means, but more so than these others. There's plenty of drinking, but likely not as much as in the northeast (or as at Wash.'n'Lee).

By Alongfortheride (Alongfortheride) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 01:08 pm: Edit

Are you talking UT as in the University of Texas in Austin, the last bastion of left of center thought in Texas? Seriously, UT and Austin are known for being a fairly liberal place. If you want a more conservative campus in Texas, consider A&M or SMU.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 01:18 pm: Edit

Based on your description, you better drop at least Oberlin, Wesleyan and Swat from your list. Yale might not be your cup of tea either. They're all terrific schools but probably not for someone who feels uncomfortable with political protests and liberal social norms.

UPenn and Northwestern will probably be OK for you. You might consider adding Rice, Furman, Emory, Davidson, Washington & Lee, and the University of Richmond instead. You might also try to get a hold of a book called "Choosing the Right Colleges - the ISI Guide" (Amazon carries it) which discusses the political climate at various schools from a conservative perspective.

A few quotes from the book:
"At Penn "there is a lot of room to express your opinion, says one student, and campus conservatives and liberals alike are comfortable enough to make their views known."

"Swarthmore treasures its self-image as being outside the mainstream of American life...When Abercromibie and Fitch did one of its catalog shoots at Swarthmore in Spring 2002, students and faculty complained about the radical disconnect between the schools culture and that promoted by Fitch...Swarthmore fiercely defends the rights of activists to scrawl vulgur economiums to oral sex on its sidewalks. A Swarthmore freshman found that out the hard way. Walking through campus just a couple of days before his family was coming to visit as part of Discovery Weekend, he noticed the chalkings of Swat's Queer-Straight Alliance and Queer Union. The student asked the leaders for the groups to remove the inappropriate chalkings. They refused and were backed by college administrators "Swarthmore encourages free speech," said its spokeman. The student was subsequently labeled as a "homophobe" by some of his fellow students."

Oberlin: "Unfortunately for students, a good deal of Oberlin's political activity occurs within the classroom. One professor says segments of the Oberlin faculty are "idealogical and aggresive." One Oberlin sophomore says "If you're not liberal and vocal about it, the community is not very accepting."

By Bunmushroom (Bunmushroom) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 01:36 pm: Edit

Penn isnt too liberal. I heard it has a fair amount of conservatives because of Wharton and just because.

Davidson and Washinton and Lee are also excellent and southern.

Northwestern isnt too radical.

Duke is not too liberal. Emory and Vadnerbilt too and they arnt as hard to get into.

Most major schools will have radicals unless you go somewhere religious. But even those places have conservatives. For example, Berkeley now has the largest number of college republicans of any school. Stanford also has a very active Republican club.

By Dreamsicle (Dreamsicle) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 01:36 pm: Edit

Wow. Thanks for the info. I didn't know some of these schools were so radially liberal.

Don't get me wrong-- I don't have anything against liberals, really. I just have a problem with too much political activism and so-called "free speech".

How's Notre Dame on the political spectrum? I hear it's pretty conservative... but they don't have a very good music program.

And yes, alongfortheride-- I am referring to UT Austin. It's my definite safety (the 10% law in Texas for public schools) and I'd go there for almost free (and get sophomore standing). The other Texas schools don't have as good of a music program though.

How are Harvard and Princeton? Are they liberal as well?

Thanks again!

By Bunmushroom (Bunmushroom) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 01:39 pm: Edit

Harvard and Princeton are both liberal overall, but more the Northeastern elite type liberals than the strong hippie activism that you think of at somewhere like Smith or Berkeley. They both have a sizable amount of conservatives however, espessially Princeton

By Mini (Mini) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 01:40 pm: Edit

"Swarthmore treasures its self-image as being outside the mainstream of American life...When Abercromibie and Fitch did one of its catalog shoots at Swarthmore in Spring 2002, students and faculty complained about the radical disconnect between the schools culture and that promoted by Fitch...Swarthmore fiercely defends the rights of activists to scrawl vulgur economiums to oral sex on its sidewalks."

This is too funny!!! It is Abercrombie and Fitch that did the nude catalogue with multiple partners in suggestive poses. And here conservatives attack SWARTHMORE students and faculty for objecting to Abercrombie's cultural preferences? I think what the conservatives objected to was that Swarthmore students dislike Abercrombie's trading of sex for money -- which is just good ol' American business practice.

This book sounds like a gem!

If you don't like drinking and smoking, and don't want hippies or liberals, and you want a good music program, I can think of only one school in the country that meets all your requirements - BYU. (But I think Davidson comes reasonably close.)

By Hubbellgardner (Hubbellgardner) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:11 pm: Edit

Come to Davidson, live in a 'substance-free' dorm, hang out with the large number of like-minded students who share your views, and you should be in heaven. English is a strong major at Davidson, just ask the authoress, Patricia Cornwell.

By Coureur (Coureur) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:12 pm: Edit

BYU is for you.

By Texas137 (Texas137) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:16 pm: Edit

look at Rice, since it sounds like you are a Texas resident. It's fairly conservative, and they have the Shephard School of Music. Also Trinity in San Antonio, Baylor.

By Aspirer42 (Aspirer42) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:33 pm: Edit

If you're religiously minded, you might want to check out some of the top religious colleges in the US, which tend to be conservative by nature. Wheaton (IL) and St. Olaf come the quickest to mind.

Aside from that, I second Davidson and Washington and Lee. Don't forget Wake Forest, which has grown somewhat more liberal over the years but is by no means anything near a 'Wesleyan'.

Most Southern colleges, in fact, will be a bit more conservative than your average American institution. This may help a bit in your general search, though the region is not always quite as reactionary as is thought. Also avoid UNC-Asheville and especially Guilford College.

That said, I still agree with SBhopeful. Nevertheless, I understand how trying to get an English degree in a university with political views wildly different from yours could drive you insane.

By Geniusash (Geniusash) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:37 pm: Edit

Hey, Carleton is way super-hippy-like. That is definately not a good choice. It's Northfield, MN companion (St. Olaf) however, would be a better fit politically and they have a FANTASTIC music program (very well known and recognized here in MN). I don't know about your stats as far as match/safety etc.

By Aspirer42 (Aspirer42) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:41 pm: Edit

St. Olaf *does* have a quite strong music program, now that I think of it. No idea about your stats either, but based on your other college picks alone, I'd peg them as a lower match/upper safety for you.

Their staff also wrote my class' calculus textbook.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:44 pm: Edit

I second St. Olaf's. Its music program is superb, as is its English department. Very little drinking and almost no drugs. It's affiliated with the Lutheran church but is accepting of all faiths. However, even there you'll find some liberal students and faculty - just not as many.

Another possibility might be Lawrence University in Wisc. Like Oberlin, it has a music conservatory but all academic departments are fairly good. Good mix of conservative and liberal students - not too much of either.

And, in Texas, check out Southwestern University - they have very good music programs and good academics overall. Very generous with merit awards. Relatively conservative student body.

Another choice in Texas would be Southern Methodist. And, as I said before, Rice.

By Geniusash (Geniusash) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 02:50 pm: Edit

St. Olaf also has a nice campus and many study abroad opportunities, I would really suggest you look into it.

By Muppetcoat (Muppetcoat) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 03:12 pm: Edit

Penn's pretty liberal, but more apathetically so than anything else.

There's probably a 3:1 liberal to conservative ratio, but I've heard more rabble from the college republicans than the dems.

By Baltodad (Baltodad) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 03:55 pm: Edit

Bob Jones University (in South Carolina) and Liberty University (Virginia) should satisfy your needs. You're extremely unlikely to be bothered by "so-called free speech" at either.

If you want a military boot-camp atmosphere to go with the lack of diverse thought, go for The Citadel (South Carolina) or VMI (Virginia).

By Muppetcoat (Muppetcoat) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 04:04 pm: Edit

Except that BJU isn't an accredited University...

Okay, so the guy was a bit of a jerk in how he worded his question, but he's perfectly entitled to want a conservative school, in the same way I said: "Okay, so my first criteria is to get a far out of the south as possible".

By Baltodad (Baltodad) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 04:13 pm: Edit

Yeah; I know. I was just giving him a little poke for the all-liberals-are-hippies attitude and the "so-called free speech" remark. (I also wondered if it was a troll post when he named several of the most liberal colleges in the country as possibilities.)

My son is going to Clemson, so I'm not one to knock generally-conservative schools.

By Dreamsicle (Dreamsicle) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 05:23 pm: Edit

Muppetcoat and Baltodad-

I apologize if I offended you in any way. I didn't say that "all liberals are hippies". I don't think you saw my post saying that I have no problems with liberal individuals. I do have a problem, however, with extreme liberalism being shoved down my throat, especially in the classroom setting, hence the thread title "no hippies".

The "so-called free speech" remark was in regards to Carolyn's post about Swarthmore, which stated, "Swarthmore fiercely defends the rights of activists to scrawl vulgur economiums to oral sex on its sidewalks". Honestly, I don't see how vandalizing sidewalks with vulgar words counts as "free speech".

The schools on my list were chosen solely for the quality of the music and English departments (excluding Carleton, as their music department isn't all that great). I'm not really all that politically biased or active; political tendencies of a school really isn't the most important issue. I did, however, want some information regarding the schools on my list so I wouldn't end up at a school where conservatism is frowned down upon rather heavily.

Here are my stats (for Geniusash and Aspirer42):

Academics:
TX public school, rank 11/1269.
IB program- HLs: English, Spanish, Calc. SLs: Econ, Physics, Comp Sci.
APs (exams)- World Hist, US Hist, Spanish Lit/Lang, English Lit/Lang, Calc (don't know which test to take yet), Comp Sci, Econ, Music Theory.
1560 SAT (800M, 760V).
SAT II- planning on taking Writing, Math IIC, Spanish, Korean.

ECs/awards:
Band, marching band, drumline. Clarinet and keyboard percussion. Pit captain (10, 12). Band council- Historian. (most improved award, outstanding musician)
All-Region band 3 years, All-Area, 1st alternate to TX All-State band.
Solo&Ensemble contest- Superior ratings.
Jazz band (9-10, piano).
NHS- Freshman Rep and President (10th gr).
Spanish Club- Secretary.
Whiz Quiz (9-10)- qualified for nationals.
Student Council.
Church youth group.
Pan-American Student forum- awards for Spanish (grammar and reading comp).
Speech and Debate Team for 2 years. Special distinction standings for NFL (Nat'l Forensics League).
Dallas Korean-American Scholarship Award.
(Eh, I don't think my ECs are really all that special... anything I could do to improve in this department?)

Possible majors:
English, Pre-Journalism (Medill at Northwestern), Linguistics, Music (not a performance major, so no conservatories)-- I'll probably double major in music and one of the first three


and for the record: Baltodad, this isn't a troll post. and Muppetcoat, I'm a she.


Thanks for all your help!!

By Dave72 (Dave72) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 05:54 pm: Edit

Carolyn, I hope you aren't taking that ISI guide as a creditable source. You did acknowledge that it's written "from a conservative perspective," but then you quote its judgments as though they were reliable. I would call it right-wing propaganda, and not useful at all for those who are trying to gain a balanced perspective.

By Lauraanne (Lauraanne) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 06:04 pm: Edit

like muppetcoat said, the most important thing about penn is the level of apathy rather than the political inclinations of the student. most seem fairly liberal but not so much that they are politically active.
the problem with penn for you would most likely be the drinking - it is a huge aspect of the social life. although you can, of course, get along just fine without drinking you do kind of stick out a bit if you're a non-drinker.

By Cangel (Cangel) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 06:28 pm: Edit

Dreamsicle - Good grief 1269 seniors! Wow! I agree with the suggestions for you. Don't discount the more liberal schools entirely, try to visit some if possible.
Also think how about how large a school you want - several of these schools aren't much larger than your senior class - which may be exactly what you want, but it will be a big change.

By A2a2 (A2a2) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 06:46 pm: Edit

Most colleges will have a sizable population of liberals on campus, so unless you specifically seek out an environment where people are uniformly conservative (Washington & Lee, BYU, St. Olaf), you're going to have to learn to deal with people who are different from yourself. On virtually every college campus, free speech is a highly valued priviledge, not a nuisance as you seem to suggest. Faculty are thinkers and they do not like to be told what to think or say. BTW, most of the sidewalk writing is done in chalk and does not qualify as vandalism. Sidewalk writing is not restricted -- conservatives & liberals, straights & gays, christians, jews & muslims are all welcome.
You are going to have to decide how important the music program is in your equation. The number of schools with excellent music programs/conservatories attached to universitites is not that great. Some good ones include Rochester/Eastman, Oberlin, Michigan, Indiana, Rice, Northwestern...

By Bunmushroom (Bunmushroom) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 06:49 pm: Edit

Rice is an excellent school and competitive to get in. Princeton is probobly the most conservative of the very liberal ivy league.

By Pinkearmufs (Pinkearmufs) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 07:09 pm: Edit

Dreamsicle, Rice sounds like a good fit. And if you're not particularly liberal, I'd knock off Oberlin.

By Path1 (Path1) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 07:23 pm: Edit

Why do posters who put a poorly chosen thread title get slammed whereas posters who express a favorable view of drug use and heavy partying get no similar response? Dreamsicle - look into some of the Catholic universities' music and english programs. They tend to have moderate leaning students and in my experience very little drug use but sometimes too much alcohol use.

By Carolyn (Carolyn) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 09:02 pm: Edit

Another possibility, since you're interested in Journalism, would be Syracuse U's Newhouse School of Journalism. Although there's drinking and drugs at Syracuse, the student body is pretty conservative politically.

And, to who ever asked, I think for some people - like the original poster - a conservative view point from a book like the ISI book may be worth taking a look at. Some may call it right wing propaganda but others may just see it as information worth considering. I don't think ANY college guide should be swallowed whole, however - everyone needs to visit and make their own judgements. What's so interesting in reading college guides is that after a while you can pretty much sense their perspective. The Princeton Review, for example, tends to bash most conservative and even some middle-of-the-road schools in my opinion. Again, what's right for one person may not be for another so it helps to read a variety of opinions and reviews.

By Baltodad (Baltodad) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 09:03 pm: Edit

Path1 - OK, a hypothetical. Would this post get slammed? -
"No Nazis for me...
I need help finding schools that aren't conservative. I'm rather liberal. Not a communist, but I get uncomfortable around people who express conservative political viewpoints and have traditional religious beliefs. I'd like to be at a place where most people respect politically correct speech codes and enjoy getting high. So far, my list includes: Brigham Young, Notre Dame, University of Alabama, and the Naval Academy."

Something tells me that would get slammed a lot worse than Deamsicle's post.

By Intheory (Intheory) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 09:32 pm: Edit

You're conservative and you're looking at Oberlin, Swarthmore, and Wesleyan? Those are pretty much the premire radical liberal schools and none of them are shy about it

By Kk19131 (Kk19131) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 09:39 pm: Edit

Stay away from Northwestern.

By Eadad (Eadad) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 11:39 pm: Edit

"The other Texas schools don't have as good of a music program though."

On the contrary, SMU's Meadows School of the Arts has an extremely strong music program and they offer a large amount of merit money as well which could offset the differential at UT. With your grades and scores, you could easily consider it a safety and expect a generous offer of merit money as well.

By Reidmc (Reidmc) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 11:41 pm: Edit

Mid-sized university or LAC, great music and English departments, but not too liberal. . .that criteria kind of narrows the choices. A strict application of the criteria would likely leave you with Rice and Vanderbilt, with maybes to Yale, Northwestern, St. Olaf, Lawrence and Kenyon. Music is on the upswing at the latter.

BTW - St. Olaf is not anywhere near as homogeneous or conservative as people think. It's nothing at all like BYU or W&L. Pretty balanced environment all around.

By Jamimom (Jamimom) on Thursday, July 15, 2004 - 11:47 pm: Edit

I would peruse the Princeton Review colleges and read up on the political leanings and climates at the schools you are considering. I agree with most of the posters here. I would add Wake Forest, James Madison, Wm & Mary, to your list. And the ISI book is useful even though it does have a bias. You just need to know that when you read the selections. It seems to me that it has mellowed somewhat from its previous edition. Also the Underground Guide to Colleges seems to have moved center from its former position over the years. Not as student centered as it used to be. Oh, and I think looking at the Catholic schools is a good idea.

By Sanfranstudent (Sanfranstudent) on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 12:12 am: Edit

well no hippies ok...
UC Berkely and Santa Cruz definetly
UW-Madison for sure, there are no white people with dread locks there at all.

By A2a2 (A2a2) on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 12:50 am: Edit

Since you are Korean, you may want to consider how diverse an institution is - in addition to how conservative it is. For example, at Davidson - only 2% Asian vs 18% at Northwestern.

By Momrath (Momrath) on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 01:52 am: Edit

Dreamsicle, Leave Williams on your list. There are a fair number of conservative students (within a mostly liberal, but not "hippy" framework) and at any rate everyone is allowed to have an opinion. The kids are very tolerant and supportive. Don't worry about the drinking -- yes, Williams kids like to party (and study too), but non-drinkers are common and welcome. My son has two friends who participate in Jazz Band and they're both extremely down to earth types.

The English department is as good as you'll get anywhere. I don't know much about the Music Department, but I understand that it is strong.

By Dreamsicle (Dreamsicle) on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 11:52 am: Edit

Thanks for all your help, everyone.

A2a2- Yeah, I did notice that Davidson was very lacking in the ethnic diversity department.

I'll take a look at the ISI book, thanks.

I'm still applying to Oberlin (for the clarinet professor, Richard Hawkins), but I wouldn't mind taking Wesleyan, Carleton, and Swarthmore off the list. And yes, I am aware that Richard Hawkins is gay, but that doesn't change anything about his musical abilities.

Added to my college list: Rice, Vanderbilt, Notre Dame, William and Mary, St. Olaf, Princeton, SMU. This list is tentative (I need to do more research on them first).

Kk19131- any particular reason I should stay away from Northwestern? Along with Yale, it's at the top of my list (as far as English and music are concerned).

By Eadad (Eadad) on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 12:17 pm: Edit

On another note, and please don't take this wrong but,I am not sure that the colleges would look at SAT II Korean as a worthwhile or credible exam given your heritage. You'd be far better served with a different SAT II. It might be viewed as "padding" your scores as opposed to showing your breath of knowledge in core subjects.

By Alexandre (Alexandre) on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 12:42 pm: Edit

I understand that Duke, MIT, Vanderbilt, Wash U., Princeton, Notre Dame, Dartmouth and Georgetown are also relatively conservative.

By Tdizzo (Tdizzo) on Friday, July 16, 2004 - 01:43 pm: Edit

BYU-Hawaii all the way (maybe Pepperdine?)

By Dreamsicle (Dreamsicle) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 12:03 pm: Edit

Really? Dartmouth is conservative? I guess I haven't read much about its political climate, but I got the impression that it was liberal from its excessive drinking and partying.

Eadad- I'm considering taking US History instead of Korean. Thanks for the advice.

Does anyone know how Washington U.'s music and English departments are?

By Bluebutterfly (Bluebutterfly) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 12:33 pm: Edit

Dreamsicle, I think that you are making a mistake in equivocating partying with being liberal. I know a lot of people who are politcally liberal who lead a very clean lifestyle because they believe very strongly is having a healthy body. On the flip side I know some young republicans who drink like fish. Also I would like to point out that most colleges contain all kinds of people. Even Darmouth has hippies and the Bush family goes to Yale. You choose your social crowd in college. If you join clubs that you enjoy you will meet like minded people. Incidentally, I attend St. John's College in Annapolis MD, which is a small liberal arts college that is an odd mix between very liberal and very conservative. Variety is the best thing. If someone's opinion makes you uncomfortable, it maybe because you need to hear it

By Dreamsicle (Dreamsicle) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 01:16 pm: Edit

I don't mind variety. I just don't want an overwhelmingly liberal school. Would the schools who are labeled as the most liberal in the country be that overwhelmingly liberal? Would Oberlin, Swarthmore, and Wesleyan really be all that bad? The only examples of "liberalism" I have of these schools are the encouragement of free speech and liberally minded professors.

By Bluebutterfly (Bluebutterfly) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 01:27 pm: Edit

I would have to ask you to define what you mean by liberal.

By Xiggi (Xiggi) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 01:52 pm: Edit

Dreamsicle~

Thank you for the post. You expressed a position shared by many. Bleeding liberals never cease to amuse me with their apparent surprise that young people could appreciate conservative values.

That said, I would not dismiss a school because of an etiquette. For instance, I have no problem with a school whose faculty leans predominantly to the left -most of them do- as much as with a school whose student body would overwhelmingly share the faculty views in a hostile environment.

The good news is that most young liberals lose their sharp edges when gaining maturity and education.

By Reidmc (Reidmc) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 02:15 pm: Edit

The good news is that most young liberals lose their sharp edges when gaining maturity and education.

This happens to young conservatives too. . .at least those who go to college.

Dreamsicle - A principal player in a top US orchestra told me recently that there is a fine clarinet professor at USC.

By Jlq3d3 (Jlq3d3) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 02:26 pm: Edit

USC is not so activly liberal and I hear has good music program. Many schools in CA like USC, UCLA, Cal, and Stanford are overall liberal but have strong conservative groups, so it isnt so bad here. I think oberlin, swarthmore, and many northeastern colleges are more liberally hostile and object to dissent compared to the more laid back schools on the west coast.

By Xiggi (Xiggi) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 05:13 pm: Edit

Oh Reid, isn't there are say that goes "When I was a young liberal, I listened to my heart, when I grew older and wiser I started to listen to my brains and became a conservative."

Joking set aside, I have my own views and my own agenda that borrows from both sides. There are as many conservative values that I categorically reject than so called liberal ones. To use an old cliché, you can map the divergent positions on a long line like the equator, and since the world is not flat, the extreme opposite views end up touching each other. In my opinion, the extreme right is as despicable as the extreme left. The problem I am having is that the extreme right is far easier to identify as an obvious cancer for our society than the liberal positions that are far more insidious. I see a lot more subtility -I am not meaning this to be complimentary- in the range of liberal positions; yet, the moderate positions could be as nefarious as the extreme ones.

Oh well, nobody forces me to listen to the messages!

By Guitarshredder (Guitarshredder) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 08:49 pm: Edit

I live by Northwestern so hopefully I can offer a bit of insight. I'm personally more of a libertarian than either a liberal or conservative. Anyway, Evanston is a very very liberal city for better or worse. It's diverse both economically and racially. I'm personally only familiar with the music part of Northwestern. The students seem liberal (like most college students), but there are very few demonstrations or anything like that. I think the last big issue was when someone wrote a bunch of racial slurs, everyone got upset and there were a few demonstrations or something, and then they found out it was a hoax.

By Baltodad (Baltodad) on Saturday, July 17, 2004 - 10:00 pm: Edit

Actually, the quote is:
"Any man who is under 30, and is not a liberal, has no heart; and any man who is over 30, and is not a conservative, has no brains." -- Winston Churchill (a conservative)

By Battleofny (Battleofny) on Sunday, July 18, 2004 - 01:39 am: Edit

======
Vanderbilt
Denison
Boston College
Washington and Lee
William and Mary
================

By Tropicanabanana (Tropicanabanana) on Sunday, July 18, 2004 - 01:51 am: Edit

>>>The good news is that most young liberals lose their sharp edges when gaining maturity and education.

Nah..the most educated people I've met (professors with PhD's) have always been radically liberal.

By Jlq3d3 (Jlq3d3) on Sunday, July 18, 2004 - 03:44 pm: Edit

There is the saying if you are under 24 and a conservative you have no heart; if you are over 24 and a liberal you have no brain.

I guess I'll have to wait 6 years to get my heart because i'm an 18 year old conservative.

By Momrath (Momrath) on Monday, July 19, 2004 - 12:13 am: Edit

There is also a saying that you become more conservative when you have more to conserve.

By Feenotype2 (Feenotype2) on Tuesday, August 03, 2004 - 08:56 pm: Edit

Definitely go for Vanderbilt. It has a nice music school, the Blair School of Music. I don't know if it's on the level of Oberlin and the like, but it's probably only a tier down. The school is fairly conservative (being representative of the south in general); however, the political enviroment is not overly active, though I'll have see if that changes this fall.

By Travelr (Travelr) on Sunday, August 22, 2004 - 01:17 am: Edit

Skidmore, NYU come to mind.