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I saw an interesting thread on another discussion board today. Here's the opening salvo:

"I saw a book today called College Finder, by Steven Antonoff. It's a compendium of lots of lists about colleges, including one about 'the 25 most overrated colleges'. Apparently a survey was done of high school counselors as to which colleges were the most different in reality from the perceptions of high school students. The top 6 overrated colleges listed were: 1. Harvard, 2. Stanford, 3. Boston College, 4. Georgetown, 5. University of Richmond, and 6. Yale. Five of the Ivy League colleges made the overrated 25; the three that didn't are Princeton, Columbia, and Dartmouth. This survey isn't a new one, so you can't use it as gospel, but I thought it was rather interesting. Comments?"

Yes, indeed. Comments?

By David Hawsey on Friday, January 11, 2002 - 09:33 am: Edit

As Groucho Marx once said: "There's less there than meets the eye."

What any college does, specifically and measurably, to help any individual build, manage, change and advance their own lives and those around him/her is up for eternal debate. The name of a college NEVER is an indicator or a guarantee that any person will be better, make more money, lead a healthier or more enriched life than someone who went to a lesser-known college. or any college at all.

So, what have we learned? Apparently, not much. Just look at the money being made off of higher education by US News & World Report, Princeton Review and Kaplan test prep products and services, The College Board, and other third-party vendors and influencers of college choice. Apparently, we're not capable of making choices for ourselves, or so we're led to believe.

The bottom line is, and always will be: THE FIT. As I've stated many times, colleges below the Top Tier are just as savvy as anyone else at helping people, young and old, develop their potential. "Second Tier, Not Second Best" will be a book on shelves shortly, once Dave Berry and I get our ducks in line. We'll be looking for quotes, impressions and thoughts from our readers and website surfers who understand the real meaning of higher education: It's not the buildings, the legacy, the prestige or the endowment of a college: it's the people.

By GFI on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 02:06 pm: Edit

George, were there any specifications as to what they meant by "overrated" when they asked the guidance counselors to name the schools? I.e., are they suggesting that Harvard, for example, doesn't live up to its lofty reputation? Or would they put it in the second tier of universities? Or is it more of a value thing, i.e., Harvard is good, but not worth $35K?

It's interesting that Georgetown keeps popping up on "overrated" lists.

By George Meany on Saturday, January 12, 2002 - 07:47 pm: Edit

I haven't got the book, but here's the Amazon listing, which contains 73 (!) sample pages of text (why buy it?). My guess is that maybe schools like Harvard and Yale, with their emphasis on graduate education over UG, may seem overrated, although Harvard seems to be a bigger offender in that category than does Yale. I don't know. Have a look for yourself.

By paul john on Sunday, March 24, 2002 - 02:34 pm: Edit

This list is strikingly on target with perhaps the exception of Yale and Columbia. Stanford and Harvard have superb GRADUATE (and esp. professional) schools and the number of graduates outnumbers the number of undergraduate students. Yale really does try to balance undergrad/grad emphasis, but it cant duplicate Princeton Dartmouth or LACS. (On the other hand, the rpesence of world class grad schools is something princeton, dartmouth and lacs cant compete with either). Columbia ? NO ADVISING whatsoever, faculty care only about grad students, ? rigor beyond the introductory core sequence; having said that the core sequence ensures EVERYONE gets educated and nobody slips through. BC and GU are insanely popular with northeastern caucasian kids, esp Catholics; yet their endowments, faculty salaries and facilites are simply not national caliber. Grad programs outside of a few professional schools are risable.

By max on Monday, March 25, 2002 - 11:21 pm: Edit

can someone who has the book, please just list the 25? this is all so amusing but very true about overrated colleges...isn't there a book about colleges that changed people's lives...?

By Dave Berry on Tuesday, March 26, 2002 - 08:39 am: Edit

Max, you're talking about Colleges That Change Lives by Loren Pope. Check out our review.

By A Reader on Wednesday, March 27, 2002 - 08:29 am: Edit

>>Apparently a survey was done of high school counselors as to which colleges were the most different in reality from the perceptions of high school students.

Since guidance counselors don't actually attend the schools they're evaluating, it's a second-hand survey. Apparently GCs are interpreting the reactions of students. However, the link between GCs and high school grads is very tenuous. When high school alumni go back to visit their high schools, it's arguable that many or most don't even stop by the guidance office, so it would have been interesting to learn how respondants made their choices. A polling of actual students' reactions might have been more revealing.

One factor that might influence the results is that ivy expectations are so high. No school is perfect and no school will meet students' every need, no matter how selective it is.

Everyone's entitled to an opinion but I wish I knew more about the methodology behind this survey. Despite possible flaws, it's interesting nevertheless.

By Dadster on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 10:19 am: Edit

Calling some colleges "overrated" is too simplistic - just like rating colleges in the first place is too simplistic! For a student who intends to show up for classes, do homework, and get a degree, Harvard IS probably overrated. For a student who wants to interact with exceptionally bright and talented peers, or who hopes to work in the lab of a world-renowned prof, or wants to build a network of contacts for a future career in politics, law, or banking, Harvard may be difficult to beat.

Most schools are what the student makes of them. A state university might be big, impersonal, and have too many large classes for one student; another might find great opportunities in the size and diversity of the same school.

By A Reader on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 11:20 am: Edit

I agree, Dadster, except that my point was that unless you actually and currently attend Harvard, you couldn't really know if it's overrated.

Overrated in terms of USNews rankings, gallup poll opinion or what?

As is, it doesn't sound like much of a valid or helpful excercise. Had the pollster phrased the question differently, in terms of favorites, it might be more credible and certainly more clear (you would know what you are getting), but it looks like Antonoff may have been looking more for a attention-grabbing sound byte than garnering legitimate and useful findings.

By Toxicity01 (Toxicity01) on Sunday, February 08, 2004 - 12:43 am: Edit

I think all the Ivies (except Yale) are grossly overrated. In addition, I'd like to say these colleges are overrated:
Boston College (I hate MA)
Boston University (I hate MA)
UC Berkeley (High crime, a lot of bums)